Crafting: Better skill = better quality = better reactions

Gameplay
#1

Probably discussed but couldn’t find it by searching… For anyone here who played Ultima Online they will understand where I’m coming from!!

Primary example (as I love archery and bows)… With regard to player / NPC crafting…

Low skill level bows = lower durability / lower damage due to lower build quality and lower draw weight.
Higher level bowyer (Grandmaster per-say) = High durability / high damage due to greater knowledge of how to craft / treat the wood stave, a better quality bowstring resulting in higher draw weight.

Fletchers the same… low skill = less flight duration and less accuracy/damage as opposed to grandmaster fletchers who would ultimately craft better shafts, attach better quality flights and also shape them better for the use of each arrow type.

This doesn’t have to be put into great detail as the system in Ultima was simply the higher your skill the game would automatically apply better stats (in the background)

For this game you could… say… in the minigames for crafting —> skill level… The faster you “complete” each section of the minigame results in the QUALITY of that part (shaft creation, fletching attachment / shaping etc) being higher (even more so with higher skill level)

The other part of this in relation to great war bows being crafted, is there a chance that character strength must be increased to use better bows? As in real life you couldn’t just pick up a 100lb draw weight bow and use it instantly… You would obviously have to have strength training, unless you are infact… Hercules!

Feel free to discuss / adapt / tell me I’m wrong / agree!

FINALLY!!! I LOVE THIS GAME SO MUCH ALREADY AND CANT WAIT FOR IT TO BE RELEASED AS IVE WAITED SO LONG FOR A MEDIEVAL SIM LIKE THIS WITH NO MAGIC / DRAGONS / MAGIC HORSES… FOR WHAT FEELS LIKE A LIFETIME AND I WANT TO TELL THE DEVELOPERS I LOVE THEM FOR TAKING THE BOLD, BRAVE MOVE IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION!!

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#2

Something that caught my attention

I like this idea. For a long time RPG’s have been about maximizing and optimizing. It would be cool to see a system based on the player’s skill rather than the characters.

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#3

Rather than relying on either player or character skill, I’d suggest this:

The actions involved in crafting need to be performed within a certain range of accuracy by the player to complete the crafting tasks. Where the character skill comes in play is that the more skilled the character is at a given sort of crafting, the more margin for error the player has. Say, the player must click a certain pattern or follow a particular series of keystrokes within X amount of time, with the higher the character’s skill, the more time you have to do it.

The idea being that even a novice could get lucky and craft something spectacular, while a master can still botch a job, which would be represented by player skill. The character skill would make it much more likely for the novice to screw up, while making it more likely for the master to succeed.

Basically, taking the idea of the D20 system from DnD, but rather than random dice rolls to provide variance in the results, using the player’s ability. That way you’re not unfairly penalizing a player who’s not as good at the crafting minigames.

2 Likes
#4

Yeah, I like games that reward player skill. And the longer you play the game the better you are at it, no need for artificial character skills imho. Also (at least for me) roleplaying is not about having stats, but acting as someone else. So I want to be crafting myself, I do not want to say my character to craft something. I do not want to tell my character to kill enemy, I want to do it myself, I want to be my character.

#5

Also a very good idea! In honesty I was slightly tired when I posted this, and words were failing me so couldn’t think properly how to word the “skill” part of the challenge! But yeah I didn’t aim to penalise newer / less experienced players :slight_smile:

All I know is I’m excited to see where this game goes and how fun they can make it! I can only really comment on smithing in terms of knowledge of crafting as I have a forge at home, and I like what I’ve seen so far!

#6

Mini games I don’t mind and they can be comfortable to play.

Can’t say I’m ever a fan of gamgling inc rafting systems however, like say 50/50 chance you’ll get something good or really bad, Diablo III is notorious for this in it’s crafting/enchanting, all that isn’t affected is jewel crafting since that appears to show exactly what they upgraded gem would provide, a gamble basec crafting system is really bad for many gamers, only the few that like it I suppose but really it should be based on either a mini game, knowledge or skill.

I quite liked Skyrim’s simple crafting system when you had the acquired skil and mats you could afford to upgrade (diablo 3 you had to pay to upgrade and even then you had to use mats and pay again hence the bad gambling system), KOA also had a sort of decent crafting system in which you could see what materials gave what stats when you added each piece (like one piece offering 2+dex, another +10% fire damage etc)

Basically anything is good as long as it’s not all gambling based, I know I’d rather not waste all my time and mats just trying to craft single item, I feel no such accomplishment or feel an effort was made if I’ve wasted more to get what I’d wanted.

#7

Also a question, what are the points impacted by the quality of the swords.
first, I don´t like the damage calculation, like an enemy with 100 life points, a sword do 10 damages, so you need to hit 10 time to kill him. Also, this system is generally improved with critical damage aspect and armor point calculation, but I think this is not enough.
If you hit flesh with a sword with a good impact force, you mostly kill or severely injured anybody. Impacts localisation is also a must. If you hit armor, you can stun and pain him, the result is an impact on the enemy stamina and awareness, also an enemy mental characteristics can lower the impact effect, as a good sword can improve it as it should be sharper than a bad one…

To summarize, a good sword must do:
Sharper one -> more damage (but the damage variation between a good sword and a bad one must be realistic)
Balanced one -> Faster attack, less stamina consumption, no sword dropping during combat (better handling)
Manufacture quality -> More solid, can break other sword
Fame -> some rare sword, very famous can scare enemy ans decrease confidence, so the way he fight against you

Of course this is only suppositions and theories, not a wishlist …

#8

Indeed I agree and points I should have noted in the original post! But yes I believe there is no “hit point” stat in game…
Therefore as u mentioned:
Better quality sword = less likely to break/rust
Sharper edges = impact harder making a greater drain on stamina and endurance of opponent
Better balance = faster swing times and less effect on balance
Aesthetically better, good quality builds look better in real life so why not in game?

The possibilities are many, wether they are implementable or not is another question!

1 Like
#9

Yes you got my point, thanks to turn my crappy English sentences in goods one :smiley:

#10

Haha your English is just fine :smile:

#11

I agree with @Paawool & @Marmu
The basic rpg health system seems outdated to me. I would love to see some innovation here. I remember discussing this in another thread as well.

This is not really a proposal though… more like a demand.
Something I would like to see:

  • Those clear hits should be devastating. If you are not trying to defend yourself, a single hit should be enough to kill you. Not necessarily instantly, but then cause you to pass out or bleed to death if you do not get medical attention
  • To balance the game, make it easy to defend yourself. And if you miss a block, you should be able to jump out of the way, to reduce the potential fatal blow to a slight cut. This would of course lead to a loss in stamina due to pain.
#12

Agreed i don’t want to look at a number to determine how good a crafter i am, i want to experience it and learn from it like i would in the real world. Why not have the mini games as close to realism as you can get? I’ve also got tired of menu based crafting systems, it’s dull there’s no way to master it then just grinding pixel materials to combined with other pixel materials in your inventory, while standing at a fake workstation to complete the process.

#13

So, maybe this is a stupid question, but does this game have leveling up/skill leveling and such? Do we know yet?

#14

There will be skills and perks, some of them can be learnt, some of them can be unlocked. So I would say it includes typical RPG skill stats. However the minigames are very based on player-skills. So leveling alone isn’t sufficient to be a good chef, alchemist or blacksmith. (from my personal understanding)

#15

Yes, but if unbalanced this can really break the immersion, because if the mini game are too difficult this can really affect the gamer experience who wants to role play for a pure alchemist or blacksmith for example.
I remember the crazy mini-game to unlock the doors in Skyrim. This killed my thief character immersion because I was not able to unlock, even at high level any doors unless I have 40 lock-pick.

#16

…The lockpicking in Skyrim was difficult?

#17

From my own experience, I will say yes and no for Master locked chest. Yes because the lock-pick tools are breaking easily, and no because they are easy to find, so after 20 tries I was always able to open the chest.
So as I say previously, it killed my thief immersion, because of the need to have more than 60 of them in the pocket.
And also the mini game was not really realistic comparing to the real lock picking Technic.
Lets see if KC implement this and how.

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