I read a while ago that about the Berserkers of Ancient Scandinavia, historians theorized that they used drugged food to get into their trance-like frenzy. Similarly the Ḥashshāshīn(Assassins for the layman) used to ingest hasheesh to get them in a trance like frenzy for a fearless assassination for their enemies.
Now while 14 century bohemian won’t have such traditions, these are both real life examples for the type of substances and ingredients that can be used as pain-killers,attack-amplifiers and speed-enhancers in armed conflict. What kinds of ‘real life’ ingredients and substances do backers think should be found in Kingdom Come and what would be their effects. Discuss.
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None should be added.
I could see some mixtures of herbs and stuff that would help heal wounds but other than that, no.
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No witches selling potions either… unless you buy one of these potions, see that it does actually nothing, and chase that supposed “witch” across the land. That could become quite a interesting side-quest.
I could see some form of stimulant back in the day, but I would suggest that you don’t count on those most of the time… probably because they would be expensive and it could be difficult distinguishing who sells useful “potions” and who actually sells fake ones.
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Has there been any mention of a healing system, alchemy or otherwise?
I’m assuming if your character is wounded you’re not going to wait around for 30 in game weeks. Or a wound becoming infected after a sword cut which quickly leads to death. There needs to be some sort of balance between realism and enjoyable game play.
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I can see the alchemy being used to create healing salves, poisons, brew alcohol to bolster courage/strength, perfumes for charisma…stuff like that, definitely not witcher style mutagens 
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Another fact we might disscus is: how will it work? Will it be made like putting some flowers to kettle or will we have to cut them, dry them, crush them etc.
Not like in Oblivion but you would actually had to know what to do with ingredients not just throw them together and wait for what happens.
I am not familiarized with theories about using drugs by assassins and also I am not aware of any historical evidence this was happening in medieval age in my country. Maybe Warhorse guys found out something else but as everyone is calling this “real medieval game” I would probably stay away from adding any kind of non confirmed things. As COP said, I would leave this “alchemy” close to mixing and preparing stuff by herbal bible based on some preserved historical collection of prescriptions from our grandx10mothers. It could be definitely connected to character class as a skill. A Thief could be more skilled as it is dangerous for him to ask for help healer NPC in public. On the other side a Knight injured in battle could be healed by more skilled character as reward for bravery in battle and use his skill points in more important skill for his class. But thats thing for another discussion.
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The name “Assassin” is often said to derive from the Arabic Hashishin or "users of hashish"
Source: Lewis, Bernard (1967), The Assassins: a Radical Sect of Islam, pp 30-31, Oxford University Press
There have been explicit statements made directly form the developers that Alchemy will be included in this game, but it will be more of a realistic portrayal of creating potions. It’s even shown in the main Kickstarter video…
Somewhere around here I have a few Medieval alchemical recipes for stuff like hydrochloric acid, including the period names. I’ll have to see if I can dig them up.
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Here we go, took less time than I thought, lol! All of these were known to Medieval alchemists (note, I do NOT have a listing of proportions or the actual process to make it):
Naphtha - A concoction of distilled petroleum or pitch, consisting of petroleum or pitch mixed with water. Naphtha could be used to coat a surface, and then lit on fire. Or it could be poured into a flask or pot, lit with a fuse, and thrown like a grenade.
Spirits of Salt (hydrochloric acid) - Produced from vitriol (sulphuric acid) and salt, and could be either concentrated or diluted by adding water. Concentrated spirits produced a corrosive gas, while diluted remained in liquid form.
Everburning Lights - This is getting more into the mythical, but was still a historic alchemical recipe. It’s a light that never goes out once lit, and was made with sulfur, alum, and spirit of wine (ethanol).
I’ve also got a few notes on Medieval poisons, poultices, antidotes and curatives, too.
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While that is interesting, I think that as the developers are trying to stick to realism, the more mythical stuff should be avoided. If any sort of alchemy is to be added it should only be, as I mentioned earlier, something that could heal a wound over time or something like that. Stat enhancing mixtures should be avoided as well because, although I’m not saying they didn’t exist, they wouldn’t have been widely used.
A quick Google search shows that alchemy in Medieval times was focused heavily on chemistry and chemical apparatus - things like hydrochloric acid, nitric acid, potash and sodium carbonate. That could make for some fun explosions
It was also associated with the darker side of society, which could make for fun quests and gameplay (from http://historymedren.about.com/od/alchemy/p/alchemy.htm)
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Due to its pre-Christian origins and the secrecy in which its practitioners carried out their studies, alchemy was viewed by the Catholic Church with suspicion and ultimately condemned.
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Alchemy was never taught in Universities but was instead transmitted from teacher to apprentice or student clandestinely.
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Alchemy attracted followers of the occult, with which it is still associated today.
There was no shortage of charlatans who used the trappings of alchemy to defraud.
Herbal and organic medicines were used, and many of them probably had real and potent effects and side effects. And a “potion” is not just for fairy tales and fantasy - it just means a medicine which is consumed, usually by drinking.
I actually like to believe there was still magic around in the world at the beginning of the Medieval period - like in the 5th century when St. Patrick used magic to kill and drive away snakes (= dragons?) and convert people from druidic traditions to Christianity. But maybe that is just me living in a fantasy world!
yes, unfortunately that is fantasy. magic and miracles aren’t real.
What kind of mixture are you talking about that heals you?
@Cop As I said, those recipes are all from historical texts. The closest to “magic” is the Everburning lights, and even that has some plausibility in a real-world setting. It would certainly make for a real source of light, even if it isn’t an infinite one. And spirits of salt is just the Medieval name for hydrochloric acid. Something that’s completely possible for an Medieval alchemist to make. So is naphtha. They’re not “magic” as all.
And of course there’s also black powder…
Also, I wouldn’t even consider potions and poultices alchemy. That would be herbalism, and arguably a completely separate skill set. And there I agree, you shouldn’t have instant “healing potions,” but something that would heal injuries over time (poultices. One involved mixing vervain with butter. I’ve got a couple others of those, too).
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Well, I don’t have any in particular I suppose. I’m not saying that some sort of herbal concoction should completely make you a new man, but perhaps dull the affects of a wound such as slow movement or lapsed vision. Depending on the affects of the wounds that Kingdom Come will have, you could make an herbal medicine that could dull those affects until you can treat it properly with bandages or whatever was available for that time.
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Ah ok sounds good to me
I understand what you are saying, but I’m just trying to point out that although those things would be possible, I doubt that they would be very widely used for this time period. I’m not an expert, though.
The only way I think that I could see it used is as a rarity. Something that you can find once in a while perhaps it would spawn in a shop randomly or even finding it in an old part of a castle. From that point you could either sell it to some other noble or save it to use during a battle.
Historically alchemy ( Spagyrics to be precise in reference on the game) was known by christian monks , mostly living in monasterys , where in parallel of the monastic life , they were taking care of the gardens , full of medical herbs and plants . They where skilled in this rude chemisrty art by preparing infusions , creams , essential oils , alcholic distilates with erbes and so on.
Alchemy ( as mentioned by some users ) was the " art " of change the state of metals , using also strange and esotreic methods to fabricate the fine gold. This was ,( and is ) a handed down knoledge , hidden by the most.
So it would be a good idea to change the Alchemy reference with Spagyrics. And it would be a very good idea to implement at least one , well done , monastery . ( ideal also for some secondary quests. )
Here an interesting link http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/medny/herbgdn1.asp .