Discussing melee combat

There are a few issues that I feel make the combat system more repetetive than it has to be.

The biggest issue is the master-strike mechanic. Most people agree that mid to late becomes a waiting game. You wait for the enemy to attack so you can master-strike them. One hit is enough with the overpowered perks and item damages.

So in my modded experience, I have removed master-strike completely. I keep perfect block, but lowered the window to the one that vanilla has for master-strikes.

However, there is more that could be done.

Lets break this down. The system seem to support a method of: First depleating enemy stamina, then going in for health damage. However, the practical application does not look like this.

Instead I would suggest the following.

  1. Master-striking does zero (0) health damage, and is only usable as a stamina lowering attack. Best used by following up with more stamina-depleating strikes.

  2. Perfect blocks can only be used when stamina is near 0. As a way to disengage from getting owned.

  3. All 5 directions have multiple patterns that are focused on stamina-damage, morale-lowering (no fleeing), and health-damage. The situation dictates what pattern is most useful.

Stamina damage: This is best used against enemies that are high in stamina (obviously) to open up for health-damage attacks. A compleated pattern increases the span before stamina starts regenerating.

Moral-damage: These are short patterns (two strikes), they do litte actual damage, but look impressive. The end result is that they lower the agression of the enemies, which allow you some method of crowd-control that does not involve backpeddling and spamming stab.

Health-damage: If they are blocked, they cost increasing amounts of stamina per successive block. So knowing when to use them is paramount to not leave you open for a enemy bumrush.

Weapons all have set damages depending on type. A longsword through the face hurts no matter if the blade is rusty or polished. But realism aside, I would like to see quality being tied to how quickly you can change direction and how well you can defend. and how much stamina a strike costs, etc. The power-creed of the current system would be greatly alleviated if all weapons had the same damage, with minor specialisations depending on weapon type… ie weapons are side-grades more than they are now.

Addition of perk-triggers.

If WHorse could add a on-swing trigger, and a on-hit trigger, then we, the community, could more easily rework the system and thus through the classic minigun-tactic find what is the best setting for combat depth as well as intuitive and rpg-mechnics fun.

Thougts?

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I agree that the most harmful mechanics are perfect blocks and ripostes (master strike). I do not agree that those are the reason why the end-game combat is so dull. (I never learnt master strike on my first playthrough and it was still dull)
The riposte mechanic is the number 1 reason why fighting is so frustrating though since every attempt on a decent chain of attacks is just interrupted with 0 effort.
Additionally you got the hillarious clinch system which allows you to break enemy defence by just spamming F and then follow up with a hit to the head - generally killing most enemies.
You need to chain attacks to drain the opponents stamina but you can’t chain attacks without first breaking his defense (because of riposte) so you end up cheesing the fight either by clinching or riposting youself which effectively ends the fight outright because 2-3 unblocked hits are enough.

As you said, stamina drain is underutilized.

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Mind you this video was made without any mods, as I never use mods in games.
Also I’m intentionally using a weak sword so that my fights would last longer.
It becomes a waiting game with the riposte, because it’s easy to do and you defeat your opponent without basically doing anything and I do agree that riposte should be nerfed somehow.

Riposte is just badly designed imo.
It should be “CORRECT DIRECTION”+ PARRY. Not just “faster parry to riposte”. It would add so much fun/value/interactivity to this move…

Overall I feel that those 5 attack directions are greatly underused. In my experience I dont even need them for anything, all fights are based on “riposte/clinch->spamming free attacks”. Feint is so fucking unreliable that its actually useless, combos are extremely hard to pull of early and extremely not needed lategame, because you kill opponent in two hits, therefore you don´t need any combos :confused:

In my opinion, combos should have been the CORE of combat (instead of parry) - and there should have been more combos.
There should have been combos which START with parry (counterattack combos), there should be combos available only when 2v1 (to deal with more enemies), there should be combo which goes from clinch, combos which REQUIRE feint and so on… And parry/riposte should be diminished to absolute minimum and special occassions (combo breakers).

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