Fire arrows?

die-mosquito-die

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I am well aware of that, that fire arrows were specially designed for sieges and for less for open battle (exception confirms the rule)

A single (c/h)uman target was not the designated target. However, if an fire-arrow would hit a single (c/h)uman target then the following thing would have probably happened depending on the hit zone and the armor and clothing if the distance is right (fire arrows are heavier therefore the distance is lower than normal arrows)

  • Clothing (Only): Definitely stuck, no questions asked
  • Gambesson (Only): It would stuck
  • Leather Armor (Only): It would stuck
  • Chain Mail: Depending of the distance, it would either stuck (close - medium range) or Ricochet, as these arrows were not designed for penetration
  • Plate: Ricochet regardless of the distance, as these arrows were not designed for penetration

@warhorse: Does arrows riccochet off palte armor if the distance is too far (for the love of god I hope so)

OK as a burning arrow stuck in a single (c/h)uman target the target should start to burn right?

Wrong it depends on the following things:

  • Does the target wear a burnable object, the following things would be burnable
  • Does the target wear flammable clothing (tabbards, surcoats, hoods) above nonflammable clothing (leather, metal)
  • Does the target wear flammable clothing without armor

The next question is what will happen?

There are the following possibilities

  • The target does only wear flammable clothes => He will start burning
  • The target wear flammable clothes over armor => He should try to put the burning clothes down, which requires a set of animation, starting with the dropping of weapon and the try to put of his burning clothes moreover he might get attacked, so there is a need of different “Death-States”
  • The target is feints due to his wound, his clothes will burn and leave only ash and the target will have burn wounds.

Moreover the following things have to be considered

  • What will happen if the player changes the weapon and an inflammable arrow is drawn (putting the arrow back into the quiver is a no-go)
  • How will the arrow be inflamed (an visible animation is nescessary)
  • What will happen if the arrow hits the ground (A fire system depending on the moistness level of the nature is important, see FarCry 3 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VOHfZBn4QQ)
  • Different behavior of material (in which material will the arrow stuck and will it aflame the material)
  • Different model states, which represent different degrees of burning.
  • Object will have to behave according to their state => Collapsing buildings due to architectural damage
  • NPC-Reactions, they will try to extinguish the fire, require AI behavior, animations
  • Fire reaction to the weather, fire arrows will have to be extinguish on heavy-rain, be less effective on target on rain
  • Different textures of clothes depending on the weather (wet clothes)

Of course there would be more possibilities, the player could prepare a small area of the ground with inflammable substances and then by shooting an fire arrow set an nonflammable ground in flames, which will lead to no fire propagation.

And more things, feel free to add :wink:

I said that I don’t think fire arrows will be at release, as the aforementioned things need to be there, as otherwise the representation would be half-ass horseshit and @warhorse wants to deliver a full-blown experience or nothing :slight_smile:

Wow
 well
 that was certainly a
 detailed answer :joy::joy::joy::joy::joy:

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Thank ou for the video about fire arrows it makes it very clear that those Things above are ver unlikel to happen.
If a human target wears only flamable clothes (most common at this time wool or linen) and is hit by an fire arrow how still is burning, the target wouldn’t often be injured so badly and can simple put out the arrow.
A human burning torch is very unlikely.

Which oject burns lighter than others depends on the kindling point and the sturcture of the material.
If the material has a dense and flat surface to the fire it needs longer to ignite.
A sheet of paper catches fire quicker at an edge than at the middle.

U could always ask them to hold still while you douse them in oil
and then ignite them with a flaming arrow​:joy::joy::joy:

Sure. If you are asking polite enought they will probably drink the unhidden offered poision.
Just bring them the concept of this sad world a little bit nearer.

Agreed, As I said if the person wears armor and a tabbard (or surcoat, hood) then only this layer would catch fire and due to the armor the person would be very likely able to put the thing down, as the fire propagation would take a while

I agree, most likely the person feints and then burn to death, if he was would be too weak to pull the arrow out or put the burning clothes down. So no running torches :wink:

Btw., I never explicitly mentioned that there should be human torches, only that they start burning, they still could try to pull the arrow out or put the fire out by rolling on the ground (there are many ways)

I think we can close this one now😂, I just very clearly saw them in use in the new trailer

Flaming arrows are basically movie and video game trope that should not be in a game that tries to sell itself as realistic. There were never used outside of siege combat, where they served as a means to set thatched roofs of the beseiged settlements on fire. Main problems with flaming arrows:

  1. How would you light them? . thre were no zippo lighters back then. You would either have to carry hot charcoals at all times, or fumble with flint and tinder while enemy archers fire at you and/or enemy cavalry charges at you. Not very feasible.
  2. How would you store them? - Quivers were desinged to store many sleek arrows, but a flaming arrow basically ends not with a sharp, sleek head, but with a messy cloth ball soaked in tree resin and/or tar. Imagine putting multiple such arrows into a quiver, and then trying to draw them in a combat situation.
  3. They would be less effective than plain arrows - the efficiency of an arrow depends on its kinetic energy that allows it to pierce armor, clothing and flesh, and cause crippling and/or fatal injuries. Since the formula for kinetic energy is 1/2mv^2, the arrow would be slightly heavier, but its poor aerodynamic profile would cause it lose velocity fast, resulting in shorter range and poorer penetration power.
  4. The fire does not do anything meaningful - it’s the piercing head that damages organs and arteries and kills. If it fails to do so, it would just cause some extra pain at the cost of the disadvantages described above.

In conclusion, there is no wonder no archers used flaming arrows outside of sieges, where you can comfortably light the arrows from the many burning fires and shoot them in a high arc, hoping they will hit a flammable roof. In direct battles and skirmishes, specialized arrowheads designed to pierce through plates (bodkin arrow), or to cause greater injuries were used, that were much more practical and effective. Yes, it looks good on camera in a movie, but from a practical standpoint, it’s nonsense.

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