NPC's: Instant death, or realism?

Gameplay
#1

There was a post similar to this from a long time ago, but it was never answered, just discussed a bit.

When you defeat someone in combat, will they collapse instantly, regardless of how they died, or (if say, they took an arrow to the heart) will they simply be neutralized, but still be alive while they bleed out on the ground? The same goes for cutting someones throat, (I think that’s something you can do in stealth), will they collapse, or actually react to their throat being cut? If they do, the animation would probably involve you holding them still and covering their mouths for a bit.

I’d prefer it to be realistic, not have people lose consciousness instantly for no reason. I was wondering if this has been considered by the devs. I don’t expect something like this to be added at this stage in development, but maybe I just didn’t know that they thought of it earlier.

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#2
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#3

The only comment from @warhorse on the matter, that i can think of.

Screen Shot 2017-01-31 at 11.20.16 AM.png739×212 31 KB

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#4

Man, you always amaze me with your search abilities. I myself wasn’t able to find it (because I have mistakenly searched for “dead man’s five”…).

Cheers to you, mate!

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#5

I think his search-fu is high because he lurks constantly on the forum. I believe he is in fact kinda in-build piece of code that simulates HC fan…

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#6

I think the official response would be the usual: It would be too much work without any benefit for gameplay…
There sure will some shorter animations played for different kind of deaths. But when NPC is dead it is dead… otherwise it could cause even some gameplay complications I would think.

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#7

I don’t think the detail, realism, and added brutality woudln’t be worth the effort. Again though, if this hasn’t been done already I don’t expect them to do it.

I don’t see what complications it could cause. Even just making it so their eyes and mouths are moving + heavy breathing while they bleed out would be good on their own.

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#8

Well complications can be numerous - every new feature is new code, new assets, new animations, new bugs. Thats just for starter… Also you would have to consider this for some quests, because it can make them much harder than they were supposed to be this way. And important thing also is “is it really worth it?” Its nice detail, thats for sure, but animation set would still be limited, so it could play out about 5 different animations, and then it would be again the same thing over and over again.
And after that, it no longer has the added wow affect, it doesn´t add much to gameplay except making it more tedious and longer and its generally almost wasted effort, for niche detail which most of the audience wouldn´t even appreciate all that much.

#9

You can make this argument about adding anything new to a game, anything whatsoever. “Well there’s be new bugs, etc” Yes, as with literally everything. This is not a good reason at all.

You aren’t thinking of this properly. Animations are only be repetitive if they’re too distinctive. I’m talking about someone lying on the ground, lightly writhing, maybe try to lift their arms. No distinctive animations, they’d just do random things on the ground that someone dying might do. Or no real movement, just whatever position they died in, but add their eyes being open, and heavy breathing for a bit. So you can see that they didn’t die instantly.

Explain then. I never suggested anyone dying on the ground be able to recover, they’d only be in this state if they’ve suffered a mortal wound. So I don’t see how it could impact quests, people would die just as easily, it would just visibly take a bit for them to die.

That most woudln’t appreciate it is baseless conjecture=/

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#10

I must agree with Wicker. I can imagine solution where conditions are goin only to the this state of object and no conditions leaving from this state so it should be minimal from programming and scripting perspective.

However KCD is kinda far to add new stuff (even if its so small like this) and I doubt it will be implemented.

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#11

I agree. But talking about things like this is useful as they may be considered for the potential sequel, if nothing else.

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#12

It is not a question of being dead, it is an issue of act of dying.

Nobody is asking for medieval Bohemian Walking Dead gameplay experience.

BTW, I think this is one of the reasons why you have kids shooting up schools and places of prayer in America and Canada. Death is always depicted as something that just happens instantly and with little to no mess involved.

Then an imbecile goes to shoot up a mosque and the reality hits him so hard that he starts crying and calls cops on self (as happened in Canada two days ago).

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#13

OK, I see how you mean it now… I though that you meant that fatally wounded NPCs with 0 health should still be able to somehow react or fight you back a while ( with a special kind of AI and animations created for various types of mortal wounds…), before they die anyway…
So I was arguing that the effort with those new animations and AI behaviours would be better spent elsewhere - a dog companion etc.

But yeah, I actually do expect that there will be various death animations for different kinds of deaths. So when health=0, AI turns off, than one appropriate death animation is chosen which simply plays out.

I think Soldier of Fortune played various death animations 17 years ago already?

Probably no significant complications with such system. Maybe few small concerns to think about

You dont want to lock the player in long animations. Especially in stealth it takes almost too long already.
Also the game should not be too unpredictable, so player can plan ahead well. You dont want to be catched by a guard because Henry took longer Stealth Kill animation this time. Or Because the NPC decided to play some long dying animation and so Henry could not move the body in time.
just BS like that

#14

[quote=“GingerFOX, post:13, topic:31402”]
I think Soldier of Fortune played various death animations 17 years ago already?[/quote]

Sorry, I meant if they haven’t added it to this game already.

As for animations, if your throat is cut deep enough, you couldn’t speak anymore, but you can still make noise. This could be simulated simply via noise detection radius. In the game “Dishonored”, you can choke someone until they pass out, or you can stop and let them go/throw them during the animation. Maybe holding them still to avoid noise could be optional, and like in dishonored, you could let them go if you like.

#15

yeah, thats what I thought too.[quote=“GingerFOX, post:13, topic:31402”]
You dont want to lock the player in long animations. Especially in stealth it takes almost too long already.Also the game should not be too unpredictable, so player can plan ahead well. You dont want to be catched by a guard because Henry took longer Stealth Kill animation this time. Or Because the NPC decided to play some long dying animation and so Henry could not move the body in time. just BS like that
[/quote]

And this was my main concern I was talking about when I said it could make some quests more difficult. Because if some motherfucker starts unexpectedly cough and scream when I try to stealth kill him, it would make me helluva mad… :smiley:

#16

Well… both is possible, you can instand kill someone, and it is possible to hurt someone so badly that he will bleed to death. So yes, it is possible that you fight someone and he will collapse completely unexpected during combat.

#17

So if they’re bleeding to death, they’ll just act normally until they die/collapse?

That’s sad. So no animations, or lying on the ground while they bleed to death?

#18

No, the animations are just not done yet. Injured persons will fight differently.

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#19

Okay, well that’s good:)

Will it be possible for someone to be dying on the ground, unable to fight?

#20

I don´t know to be honest, I will have to ask about this, but I don´t think so.

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