You are ok with the fact that it will cost 400k, which could be spend for more useful stuff?
true, this is something people often misinterpret, the money values behind stretch goals only have a peripheral relation to the actual costs, it just states: if we get this far then we put this into the game.
In this case itās even a reason why this proposition was made, because there is a good trade off between work and costs.
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Even if it would only be 10k.
How is simply unlocking 3rd person for free worse?
Whatās the logic behind that?
There are much more time and money consuming things which canāt just be unlocked with mod tools.
Please, think about that.
if it would be just unlocking, you may have to reread the original post. 
and referring to mod tools - itās the easy answer for anything you donāt like, not necessarily the best.
(and it could be applied to half of the stretch goalsā¦)
You know, there is a 1st person mod for GTA V on PS3.
On a fucking console!
It doesnāt get more restrictive.
Now tell me how can it be so hard to do it via mod/dev tools when they are already using 3rd person for developing stuff?
No, it canāt.
Because unlocking something which is already there is very easy compared to recode core gameplay mechanics or add something completely different!
3rd person camera is not something completely different.
Itās there, they use it for developing purposes.
Console = device (PS3^^)
Itās not just changing some cvar in the software dev console of an engine.
Some guy did this on PS3 and you keep insisting on the fact thatās too hard to unlock via mod/dev tools on a computer, where you can manipulate the files like you want with ease?
hey you started with the modding stuff, and at least half of the stretch goals is moddable stuff, just adding content. 
and that the 3rd person view still needs a bit of work/polish, was the original statement.
Well, Iāve not yet voted, but my opinion is that this should definitely not be the next stretch goal.
I donāt want any more resources spent on this additional view and if the resources required for a fully functional TPV are so small, then donāt add it via a SG but add it just because you figure itās there anyway and itād be silly not to.
What I would much rather see as a SG is a complete and utter first person experience, including all cutscenes and during dialogue (or enable this as an option which is clearly more work to create). Or possibly something like a more advanced hardcore mode and/or fully customisable, configurable and scalable HUD (current HUD elements are large and intrusive IMO and donāt do justice to the superb environment art IMO. Will post more on that later when I have a bit more time).
Iām not against the option of a TPV (though Iād not really use it myself), but I donāt want to see it come at the expense of anything else in the game.
FYI - I also think that realistic racing games should be played entirely from first person BTW :P. If I want to see my car from the exterior I can watch a replay and (in an ideal world) would be able to walk round it and physically get in, pre and post-race, all from the first person viewpoint.
Yeah, to reiterate my point from above, if they want to make a TPV available because theyāve re-evaluated it, they should just do it. Iād rather it not be an actual, specific stretch goal.
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@rataj @Asgo
Whatās the problem?
Itās only a little polish for only 400k.
Do you need some helping hand for the facepalm? 
Wo nimmste das her das da kein Freeplaymode kommt/ist?
Soweit ich weiĆ soll das eher wie Skyrim sein,nur ohne Magie&Fantasyā¦
sprich du hast in Act1 ne Menge an Quests und die kannste,musste aber net abreiĆenā¦sie fĆ¼hren dich nur von einem ort zum Andernā¦also von daherā¦und die nachfolgenden Acts sollen ne art Quest/Gebietserweiterung seinā¦wenn dem anders ist sag mit bitte wos stehtā¦auĆerdem wenn das Game wirklich gut wird,werden modder wie in Skyrim den Content erweitern/Welt freischalten
Where you get the Storyclosed thing from? i think it is more like skyrim without magic/fantasythings and the acts are only a bunch of quests/ingamecontent which you can do?!
I think we already hat the talk about the money, feel free to read it again.
Dark Messiah of Might and Magic is great because itās 1st person. Itās specifically made to be great with this perspective. The game would very likely be much worse in 3rd person. Or take Thief. The game is made for 1st person and nobody claims that it also should have 3rd person view. Or take Metro. Or Half Life. Or whatever other game made specifically for the 1st person perspective. They all offer a specific experience on purpose. Because the devs wanted to craft a specific experience for the gamers.
And I may remind you that we donāt talk about āfullā 3rd person here. According to Dan the game would have full 1st person mode and some kind of weird āwhen itās possibleā 1st person mode. So when you enter a house the camera changes for example. For people who are afraid of motion sickness this is probably the overkill, and not a solution. For everyone else itās just weird and imo a total immersion breaker.
So for me itās still something of the category: "if you canāt or wonāt do it right (and ācompleteā) donāt do it at all. Why giving up part of the uniqueness or one of the unique selling points of this game for and half-assed thing like that? Sometimes less is more. Sometimes being niche means being focused on your core strengths. Sometimes limiting your games means that you want your customers to experience a game the way you crafted it. Sometimes giving less options is a good thing.
And with CryEngine you have the perfect possibility to enable people to mod stuff like that in themselves without a big hassle and without the need to compromise the unique vision for your game and its special look and feel.
And again, making it a stretch goal is imho still the worst idea.
5 Likes
And you can feel free to read my post again where I compared a merely measly
10,000 to free.
But it actually is not free and itās also not just 10k.
It will be only for free via mod/dev tools.
Or do you just need some random reason to spend money?
Then thatās fine, but I donāt think itās a wise decision to spend the money that way.
Thatās why Iām against it too.
The other point being that itās against itās initial vision of Warhorse themselves.
And/or just a waste of money.
We will get the exact same tools the devs use themselves.
So 3rd person is already a given thing.
Iām not interested in repeating myself, in particular if you donāt get it the second time roundā¦
Anyone can have an opinion if this is a good choice for a stretch goal, I for one have seen worse (even in this kickstarter). But since it is to a certain degree a subjective issue it doesnāt really matter if we agree.
The question if itās a waste of money is then directly linked to your personal opinion
Because he got the PC version already, right?
How do you come to that conclusion?
Just because a have my own view on things?
I think everything that needs to be said has been and people are at the point of repeating themselves. Iām going to wait and see what Warhorse decides from here.
Maybe the next stretch goal could be varieties of armour and different weapons? Not like 3 plate armours you can wear for the whole game or 10 weapons you can use. Something that would make the game more fun, coz everyone likes to have a shiny armour and a nice weapon every so often. Also wear on the armour and sword loosing its edge? so you would have to repair it and not take like 50 blows to your armour and it will still look like new.
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Of course, I didnāt say anything otherwise.
But the game he is manipulating to achieve 1st person is the (ancient gen) console version of the game.
And my point is, just to repeat myself again, itās harder to do on a closed system like a console versus just use mod/dev tools on a PC to unlock a feature which is already used by the devs themselves. No additional extensive money and time consuming coding necessary. Itās free. You arenāt happy about free stuff that does the same job as something else which will for sure cost money?
Warhorse have stated in several post of them is using 3rd person for developing and testing things.
Itās already there!
Thatās my point.
Nothing more, nothing less.
Just let people use the mod/dev tools to unlock 3rd person and use the saved money for another stretch goal.
Could you please continue your off-topic discussion about console modding of GTA somewhere else?
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