[Top] 5 Worries

I guess I can’t really call this my “top 5 worries”, but these are some things I’ve been thinking on. Your thoughts?

5 Worries

1) NPC pop in – I have noticed in several user submitted videos that NPCs will “pop in” the world, as opposed to simply existing in the world. This is how Assassin’s Creed handles NPCs and it’s annoying. You can turn around a corner and see 5 people, turn back and around again and there’s only 2 now. Or just running down a busy street you’ll see NPCs pop in left and right. They aren’t “real people” that exist in the world, but are just generated at who knows what intervals to give the illusion of a bustling city. I hope KCD won’t be like this and it’s just an aspect of it being alpha.

I like the idea of a world where it’s a bustling, alive world with a functioning eco-system, etc., whether YOU exist in the world or not.

2) AI shortcomings – One of my biggest beefs with games like Skyrim, etc., is how many people act like they’re always meeting you for the first time, only having the same four things of dialogue to say, etc. I don’t know how long it ought to take for someone to recognize you (there’s a difference between seeing some twice a week and twice a month in regards to cementing them in your memory), but certain people ought to recognize you at some point, and others ought to know you by name.

Basically, I want dynamic AI and dialogue. I think NPCs should have more full-fledged personalities. Moods should change based on organic things happening. For example, a farmer is typically in good spirits, but if in the middle of the night you destoy some of his crop–anonymously–the next morning he should be angry, and maybe even suspicous. If you start talking to a lady and she’s being cordial, etc., but then you ask some inappropriate questions, her mood should change. Her opinion of you should change, etc. These are just basic examples, but you get my point.

3) A non-interactive world – If I jump in a puddle, I want to see a splash, ripples, etc. I should be able to knock over, pick up, interact, etc., with anything reasonable in the environment; my interactions should not be limited just to things the game wants me to interact with (thistle, whistles, spoons, etc.). If there’s a broom leaning against the wall, if I bump into it, it should fall over. I should be able to pick it back up and re-lean it against the wall. If I move the broom from one side of the room to another, an NPC should be able to still locate the broom and use it to sweep the floor, etc. If I’m walking through some brush or a low hanging branch, I should see it get pushed aside with an accompanying sound effect as I move through it.

Also, I don’t like how NPCs walk out to a field, then magically they pull out a hoe and start working. I want them to retrieve the hoe from their barn, etc., and then walk out to the field, work the field, and then when they’re done, bring it back to the barn, etc.

This applies to your PC too. He should only be able to utilize weapons that he’s able to carry on his person (that you can SEE are on his person; unless it’s a concealed weapon). And, in regards to other items, he should only be able to carry what he can put into his pockets, in a pouch hanging by rope/string from his neck, or into a satchel, rucksack, etc. Additional items would be carried by your horse or stored in your home.

4) A non-living world – Meat should be sold in towns that is locally hunted and supplied. If you kill the hunter(s), then the meat supply should start to run out, forcing them to need to acquire the services of a new hunter, or purchase meat from a nearby town. But, to cement my initial point, the meat sold should specifically be the meat caught. It shouldn’t just be supplied magically at pre-determined intervals.

If I hear cows mooing, or other animal sound effects, I should be able to locate where that sound came from. Simply adding in certain sound effects for the illusion of a living, breathing world is lazy. I recall someone commented that they heard a cow mooing, but there’s not a single cow in town.

Farmers working in the field should actually be growing and tending to actual crops, that they then harvest and supply/sell to the community, etc.

Materials the blacksmith needs ought to be acquired from miners, etc. If you interfere with the ore supply, etc., it ought to raise prices, cause backlog, require blacksmith to buy form nearby towns, etc. etc.

Should be a functioning animal ecosystem with food chain. Deer, boar, wolf, bear, hare, fox, otter, sheep, rodents, birds, etc. Maybe there can be quests to hunt down a pack of wolves that are killing off all the deer, etc.

Just a few examples here, but you get the point…

5) Lack of realistic blood/gore – They claim there are 18 basic attack combinations, totaled from the 6 zones of the body you can attack. Is blood reflective of where you attack? If I strike an unarmored person’s right arm, will I see blood soak through the clothing? They claim, “Clothing will also get progressively more worn, dirty, or bloody through use, affecting the character’s appearance.” Is this dynamic then?

Is it possible for swords/axes to dismember, decapitate enemies? I’m not talking Skyrim-esque “finishing moves”, but more like extremely rare occurences rooted in just the right circumstances (someone who is not properly armored, where you able to execute a succession in critical strikes to the same location).

If my right foot steps in a muddy puddle, but my left does not, will I see the splash from the water/mud soak a bit into my right shoe, maybe a little bit on the bottom of my right pant leg? (assuming they add splashable puddles into the game). In addition to this, will the game implement foot prints, depending on the situation (soft dirt, stepping in water/mud/blood should create footprints)?

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my biggest fear is people expecting too much then slating warhorse for it not living up to their unrealistic expectations .

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Valid point, and I’m not sure if you’re necessarily commenting in regards to the 5 worries I posted. If so, it should be noted that this game hasn’t been advertised as just another game on the block, but a realistic game, historically accurate, etc.

So it shouldn’t be out of the question to desire, and in some instances expect, a different experience in regards to world immersion.

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no i wasnt i was just posting a general worry of mine that i feel many of the bigger games full down on through over advertising and building too much of a hype

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Warhorse should be able to implement these in the game but simulating reality and running it on 4GB RAM machines is… well very hard.
Good points thought, I’m sure they’ll be ale to add some of these to an extend. :smiley:

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X1 allocates 5GB to games and PS4 allocates 4.5GB to games.

I believe you can get more allocated (probably an additional 1GB), but it probably requires several hurdles to jump.

Obviously this isn’t as impressive as the RAM a beefed up PC can have, but the games being properly optimized for these systems ought to be able to do some amazing things that were simply unachievable with 360 and PS3.

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Biggest One for all three ACTs,
A Windows 10 with DirectX 12 compatibility!

some of those have been addressed already. please search around for answers before posting. npc pop in is due to the region being cut out for the game. in the full game, they’ll travel in from other towns.

the second problem should be obvious, don’t you think? they don’t even have voices yet, obviously these are placeholders.

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The second problem is not a critique of the alpha. And that’s why I didn’t call that, or any of these, “problems”, but rather “worries”. Much of the things I outlined require a wait and see approach. Even #1. The game still can be impacted by NPC pop in issues that are unrelated to the region being cut out for the game.

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While a very interesting read, it surely would add to immersion, but not neccessarily to gameplay. To find the balance is up to WarHorse and they will fail - for some people (the fewer the better, but still),

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As far as I know devs said that decapitation will not be possible - people were asking this since Kickstarter but I never pay much attention to it so I’m not certain.

It is their point - create a living world. I don’t know how many videos about KCD you saw and how much you read but Dan Vávra and Viktor Bocan talk about it at GDS 2014. About it I mean AI daily routine and alternatives (NPC goes to the pub unless its raining). Dan talked about NPC spawn - it is not wanted but sometimes necessary for quest (captured bandit will probaly spawn captured when player take the quest). But normaly each NPC will have work, home, prefered activities and will do that independetly to the player.

I think that the 2nd point you mentioned is quite possible but I’m not sure about the depth of that.

I wouldn’t really say that above 4GB of ram is beefed up. Ram is pretty cheap so i think 8GB is fairly standard for mid range pcs now.

Yeah theres an entire thread covering it actually.

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My top worry are the AI shortcomings - Warhorse seems to be developing a system similar of that Bethesda originally wanted for their games (was called Radiant AI), but failed. With Oblivion what they showed at conventions was drastically different in terms of AI than in the released game, where AI was easily one of the weakest points. I remember Bethesda saying that they scrapped the good AI system, because it made the game almost impossible to debug (too many possible outcomes of player actions combined with things cross interacting). I know that this was some time ago, technology has advanced and WH has some good developers, but nonetheless it seems to me that the AI will be hard to do if they want to truly beat other big RPGs.

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I could not recall more realistic and logical suggestions than yours! You sir @Pengman19 deserve more likes!
I hope @warhorse implement all of your ideas, because they are mine too. I’ve always dreamed of such a game and felt Deliverance should be exactly this.

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Appreciate the kind words, but more appreciate other people wanting such immersion!

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I’ve never really seen a game where it keeps the foot prints in the mud. Say like there is a muddy road and you walk on it. In games that i’ve seen, your footprints disappear after like ten or so. i would love to track an animal via following its tracks.

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AC3 actually has really good environment effects. You leave foot prints int he snow and mud. In Mafia 2 if you walked through a blood puddle you would leave bloody foot prints, I really hope KC:D could implement these features as well.

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That’s one of things I really loved about AC3. When you moved through deep snow, the sound effects of the “crunch” through the snow, the animations of how you’d move through deep snow were fantastic, and the fact you’d leave a path/footprints behind you was stellar.

Some people might define things like this as unnecessary detail, but I think that if you’re trying to make a realistic game, you want to do anything possible to make your world immersive. The main character in AC does a lot of extremely impressive things, but when you execute these behaviors in a world that is more immersive, it makes those “impressive” things seem more realistic, more believable.

Obviously AC has a lot of shortcomings, like pretty much every game, but I think that it is trying to make you believe you’re in a living, breathing world. I would argue very strongly that AC Unity is actually the most immersive game yet. Even though you can’t communicate with NPCs, unless it’s a shop owner or part of a quest/story line, there’s SO MUCH going on in the world, and SO MANY NPCs, it’s very immersive in that regard. If you walk the streets and really pay attention to all the different behaviors NPCs can execute, it’s very impressive.

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