Video update 01.10.2014 ------> FEEDBACK thread

Gameplay
#21

@ThomasAagaard

Aalborg had a fire problem - good story :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

There are many opinions there - to the colorful clothes. In the early Middle Ages it was probably banned in general, later you did not do it, because it was considered wealthy and expectations triggered (donations / taxes / envy). Also from the government and the church, it was not welcome (arrogance / sin) poverty was sexy. Of course there were not only brown and gray, but rather materials / wool that could be colored with pigments cheap. It was work clothes.
Headgear was common in public, for married women (under the hood) anyway.
As I said, there are many opinions, I consider this for obvious

#22

Hello @warhorse @TobiTobsen,
first I want to congratulate you about that awesome job youā€™ve done over the past few months!
Surely, last video update looked great and everyone is eagerly anticipating the Alpha!

Meanwhile, I and many others watched with curiosity how Viktor fought against that armored knight. The AI seemed pretty solid and responsive to be able to smash the man who basically created it smile Viktorā€™s only kill came by outsmarting the knight after he got him stuck behind a wooden fence then shot him with a bow. This was very thoughtful of Viktor, but raises some questions about general NPC movement possibilities.

I want to suggest you to consider making any NPC able to jump over small obstacles (like that particular wooden fence). Depending on their age, gender, equipment and skill different NPC should have different proficiency of passing over obstacles. For example that knight should have a hard time jumping over the fence because of his cumbersome armor, but nonetheless he should be able to get past it after a while. This would add to Deliverance so much immersion that many gamers would actually feel like playing against real people, not AI.

On the other hand, this wooden fence will be better if made destructible (in a future release). I know destructive environment is difficult to make and takes a lot of programming time, but it also adds immersion. No need to be able to smash through walls or something, just the possibility to destroy most of the weak wooden objects (lanterns, fences, poles, tree branches) which should come down after a few strong hits. In that particular gameplay situation, the armored knight sees Viktor pulling a bow on him and tries to go over the wooden fence. After a short struggle, the AI realizes that it wonā€™t be able to jump over fast enough, so it takes a few hard swings to the fence with its longsword and destroys a narrow passage to get by that obstacle. In the meantime Viktor may have already shot at him, but maybe he wonā€™t have enough confidence to draw a bow in such short distance because he knows that the AI can get to him one way or the other. Sounds good to me, what do you say?

Maybe even add a carpenter or a repairman role for a purposely made animated NPC whose job in the game should be to take care of damaged environment caused by the gamer or any other NPC. Why not - it is as realistic as possible and is also historically accurate smile

Thank you for your time!

1 Like
#23

The teaser trailer at end is great, remember me The Lord of the Rings, with this music :wink:

1 Like
#24

Iā€™m not convinced that a longsword is ideal for woodchoppingā€¦ it lacks momentum being rather light for the purposeā€¦

#25

Actuallyā€¦

That fence shouldnā€™t have stopped him at all.

4 Likes
#26

I was thinking about the AI and seems pretty solid in fighting and i really like it, i know it may need some polish of course but anyway looks very good, but would be a nice addition if when aimed with a bow, like the head shot that happened in the video in a face to face fight/duel, it try to take cover if possible or try to dodge the shot in someway in addition to try a kamikaze attack hoping to hit you before you quick shot him.
As if it happened in a real fight/duel, the AI may warns that the player has equipped a bow at short distance and probably will attempt a quick shot. If the distance is not appropriate for a direct attack, why not try to find cover ,if possible of course, behind a tree, a rock, kneel behind the fence like in the video and try find a better cover/attack spot or behind anything good in the surrounding environment and try a diversionary attack against the player.

1 Like
#27

anyone know what was spoken during the segment showing an example of the facial capture animation? sounds like a latin sermon

#28

Its from czech movie about Jan hus
here is that scene http://youtu.be/ItA_zASJ8PM?t=3m40s

1 Like
#29

It may be translated as:

Rest assured that a common farmer, journeyman or a poor woman living pure and godly life are greater in the eye of God than a priest, archbishop or pope living in a sin.

Jan Hus was ordained a priest in 1402 and started preaching in the Betlehem Chapel the same year (this is where the sermon takes place in the movie - donā€™t hesistate to visit it when in Prague). Not only did he switch the language of the mass from Latin to Czech, but he was also preaching against the sinful ways of the Catholic church. This very sermon could have been delivered at about the same time the game is taking place.

The chosen sermon actually sums the greatest danger Hus posed for the church - he was preaching that deliverance may be reached through personal deeds and godly life. The whole Catholic church stands for two millienia on the idea that one can reach deliverance only through the body of the church, and all who are not part of it will be deniend access to heaven.

3 Likes
#30

I love youā€™re teaser music Itā€™s Master full sir! I can see now why you like this mans works before. Defiantly give him the contract and keep doing what youā€™re doing on the sound front. Also in the combat front loving it but can we have the difficultly turned down so i donā€™t have to bow kill everyone ( j/k i know there will be difficultly settings like in all games im shore. and even if not it wont be that brutal out of alpha). ^^

In all other things as well keep it up. everything you show i like and canā€™t wate to play the alpha. As well i donā€™t mind you not getting it done when you wanted. I would prefer to play what you want to offer as you feel its ready. If that takes more time then so be it. Great job warhorse staff. Please continue youā€™re fine work gentlemen and ladys.

#31

God, what a worthwhile post! I had no idea armor gave you that much movement.

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#32

It seems rather easier than in this great soviet adaptation of Walter Scottā€™s classic:


(please go to 1 hour, 21 minutes)

1 Like
#33

There are plenty more where that came from; but Iā€™m puzzled that anyone would think someone going into war conditions would deliberately wear something that seriously hampered motion, even at benefit of armor. All the research I see indicates that movement was still primary in consideration. Not to mention the following videos demonstrating this concept quite nicely:

1 Like
#34

Yeah, you got some point - the longsword in not an axe, but nonetheless it can do the work, believe me! Blasting through a small wooden fence is not exactly wood choppingā€¦
Maybe @warhorse could make destruction dependable of the weapons type, for example if the knight is armed with an axe or hammer or a mace, he could smash the fence quicker than if he is swinging a sword. Bows and daggers wouldnā€™t be able to destroy the fence or at least they would, but very slowly.

@phydra Wow thatā€™s an amazing videoā€¦
Iā€™d never knew that a person in full plate armor could be so agile!
Thanks for sharing!

#35

@tunak Thatā€™s why I donā€™t believe everything we see in a movieā€¦

1 Like
#36

Of course. On the other hand, during a prolonged fight or especially full scale battle or siege even the most resilient hero should in fact feel the weight of armour (about 20 kg for full plate set I suppose + maybe another 20 kg of mail underneath?) and weapon + feel the accumulated fatigue of his previous actions (more vanquinished foes = more fatigue, I suppose).

Should the game (which claims to aim for realism) represent this (lets name it for example) accumulated fatigue in some way? And therefore compensate the advantages of full plate armour and disadvantages of lighter forms of protection (mail etc.)?

#37

blasting through a fence is a a hollywood plywood prop technique. real wooden fences are usually built sturdily to withstand elements and winds. if an armored person wants to get over it, heā€™ll just clamber or roll over it. chopping itā€¦if youā€™ve ever chopped an even small tree branch, is not so easily done. you would be wasting time chopping a small gate for yourself.

the fence thing was an obvious exploit. they perhaps didnā€™t implement climbing yet for ai during combat or it wasnā€™t working properly, so the knight was stuck.

#38

when we talk Documentaries about armour this one is one of my favorites:


It was made in 1924ā€¦ so why did the misconception of medieval armour ever get any support???

About weight. The plates should not weight more than 20-25kg and you usually only have mail in the areas where the plates donā€™t cover. not under the plates. (the mail is attached to your padding)

The total is less that what a typical NATO soldier carry when they walked patrols in Afghanistanā€¦ and the weigh is better distributed over the body.

ā€“
I have been watching the video update a few time moreā€¦ And the more I watch it the more impressed I am with your work.

If I ran one of the danish castle museums and had the cash I would try to hire you to make the castle with npcs and all the furniture and so on and get you to make a small game showing it. Having a ā€œmodā€ like that to use for the education would be great.

Would actually be a useful tool for trying to recreate the castle when you only have ruins or parts of it.

#39

Well I humbly take the liberty to question the part about distribution of weight. It is quite easy to climb a 3000m high mountain with a 40kg backpack (personal experience). But try to transfer substantial part of this mass directly to your legs and hands. It should considerably influence your movement possibilities and the load of your muscles. You would probably need more energy to move your limbs.

But I must admit the only armor I have ever dressed was a simple mail so I am not the most competent person to discuss this subject.

This text seems to nicely sum your favorite documentary :
http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/aams/hd_aams.htm

#40

I highly doubt that. At least the ā€œeasyā€ part. (personal experience recon)
However, itā€™s true that the distribution of weight might not always be an advantage, but I think in case of this armor it is. At least from what I have seen in dozens of documentaries (I have never had the pleasure of wearing those). Further, were talking about half the weight soldiers are carrying around today. Itā€™s quite surprising how ā€˜lightā€™ it actually is.

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