Why is the lockpicking not life like at all?

Gameplay
#68

They don’t have tumblers as medieval locks were not pin tumbler locks, they were warded locks.
These were then superseded by lever tumbler locks
Which now compete with (in the UK at least, though low security ones are used as interior locks and high security one .range from back doors to gun cabinets, as a secure lever tumbler lock (5 or more levers) is harder to pick or force than a pin tumbler lock) the pin tumbler lock, which only really became popular in the mid 20th century.

So there are no tumblers in the lock as pin tumbler locks weren’t invented then. There was the Egyptian lock design which is similar to a pin tumbler lock but they never became popular in medieval Europe.

From wikipedia:
"In 1805, the earliest patent for a double-acting pin tumbler lock — one where lifting the pins too much or too little prevented opening — was granted to American physician Abraham O. Stansbury in England."

#69

And yet you are trying to make the far more rediculouse argument that a bad and unrealistic lock picking system is inteisic to an RPG. They said they wanted to make a realistic RPG, and the system is in no way realistic. While some unrealistic things can obviousely be let go for the sake of gameplay, making a better locking system is not one of them. Because having a better lockipick (or otherwise) system does not reduce is gameplay.

#70

If yiu read other replies and comments you will see that i jaut used those tumbler systems as examples of the fact that you can make life like lockicking systems. As i have said many times, due to their being a huge variety f locks, locking was not very popular since it only worked well with certain types. Either breaking to lock or using skeleton keys was far more popular.

As i have also said before, a much better system would be one that has you tying to make as little noise as possible while breaking a lock, and then as you explore you find skeleton keys, so that you have an option to try out your skeleton keys first. However you still have to try and pick the right key, as you would in real life.

#71

I dislike the current system too, I quickly scrolled through and saw that 80% of the posts were from someone shouting “git gud!” over and over and over.

Speaking honestly I would rather they fix graphical bugs, the destroying armour and other defensive clothing with bare fists, refine swordfighting combo mechanics and alter the save system so my PC isn’t a space heater until I go to a bed I can save in and quit (a single use checkpoint at “quit game” would do) and the ability to choose a difficulty setting need to be done first.

I understand what you were getting at, picnicking does require time and patience and I’ve only ever had one (real, tangible, hold it in my hand) lockpicks snap on me and that’s because it was from a cheap made in China set as well as the fact I was using it to very violently take a lock on which I used too much tension, since I was doing this with my front door (as I’d gotten bored with the assortment of locks sitting in the living room) to spend ten minutes using an extractor pick along with a whole lot of hoping that I hadn’t fucked the lock in my front door up.
So picks in-game shouldn’t snap like twigs and when you do snap one you have to remove the broken piece first.

I would like to see a system redesign, just not pin-tumbler locks as it would be massively anachronistic and immersion breaking, for me at least.
Skeleton keys sound good. You could also use a pick to throw the bolt by following the same “channel” as the real or remaining part.of a skeleton key would.

#72

Ya i see what you mean. And i completely agree that there are definitely other things that not only need attention but should take priority. However i see nothing wrong with adding something closer to the end of the list. Devs should always be looking for ways to improve their game sand players should never stop giving potential suggestions just because other things are more important at the time.

I am by no means demanding this system be changed by the next patch, but it is something that i want to bring to their attention.

I also realized i should have made my original post more clear and should probably go back and add the potential new system tha i had briefly mentioned earlier. The tumbler systems are just the easiest and most common to find in video games so they make the best examples of good lockpick only systems, even though they are not the correct types of locks for this time period. Even games like skyrim use a lockpick system which is more about patiance, and only shows you the actual front of the lock.

#73

Oh I’m fine with a more realistic lockpicking system especially if it makes the lockpicking more difficult.

I’m just stating that you misrepresented what they said and the lockpicking system is clearly one of the rpg elements without much focus on realism which is what I meant.

#74

Except the way you can look at their statemnt is they werebt after one or the other, but rather mixing real things with rpg elements. Sure at times one will win out over the other, but in this case it is neither. They also have consistently made a fairly big deal about the fect that they have been striving for a great deal of realism in this game. One of their big main points was them hiring histories to ensure historic accurace for weapon and armour styles, events that happen in the game, and even mechanics like combat (to be as realistic as possible while still being fun).

I did not say making a realistic game was their only priority, but it is most definitely been a priority that they have talked about many times when telling the public about developing the game.

#75

Yes that’s for sure, but I doubt lockpicking realism was on their agenda although I would also love to see that. It would be a massive outcry from all the bad players that are crying about the current lockpicking system, but screw them.

If we could find out exactly how the locks were like during 15th century Bohemia that would be magnificent

#76

Thebthing is there really is not exact when it comes to locks from that time period. Which is why i suggested the system i did, which gets rid of using lockpicks themselves all together. And is less about the fear of breaking your method for opening locks and more about the fear of getting caught while opening them (a far more realistic fear for a theif).

Locks from that time period and earlier varied greatly because there was no real standard to them. Locks made by one smith would generally be a certain design, while if you went to a different smith, the locking mechenism could be completely different. This is why thieves carried multiple types of skeleton keys. While one skeleton key may work on a few different locks, it was most certainly not one size fits all. Even lockpicks didnt really work on every type of lock, which is why they were not commonly used. Breaking a lock or using skeleton keys were pretty much the main two methods because they worked for every lock (assuming you had the right type of skeleton key of course). Lockpicks would work well on some spring loaded locks, but then be rather worthless for others. Spring loaded locks were around in this time period but they were still rather rare, and it easnt like everyone just replaced their old locking systems when these new ones came out. While some newer chests would have spring loaded locks, the many older chests and doors would not (though havig locks in general was also not common, they were expensive, so even having keys for locks was a status symbol).

#77

What would be interesting then would be to have different locks in the various towns while nobility and certain high security locks could be completely different from those altogether. Certainly would be interesting if implemented into the game, would be a lot of work though, so probably won’t see anything like it until all the bugs in the game are fixed

#78

I dont want to hear complaining about how hard lockpicking is when your lockpick skill is 0! Or even under 5…i almost open easy lock with controller with my skill at zero. You have to get experience whoreson!

#79

And your reading skill must be a 1 or 0, you obviousely need to go see the scribe because you did not actually read the post what so ever. I said that my real issue with the system is how unrealistic and essentially crappy it is. Which is an issue for a game where developers have put a fair amount of emphasis on using realistic systems, things, and enviroments.

Please actually read posts before making ridiculous comments that clearly demonstrate that you only looked at the first line or even just the titel and decided you should make a comment.

This was in no way a post asking for an easy lockpicking system. It is asking for a completely different system that would actually match with how opening locks in this time period worked.

#80

Yes as i said i am by no means asking that this be put at the top of the list. I just want it to actually be on the list, even if it is near the bottom. There are far more important issues to fix, but that doesnt mean future imporvements should just be cast aside and ignored.

#81

Lol. I wasnt responding to any particular post or you. I was just leaving a general statement. Theres a lot of complainers out there.

#82

There are a lot complaining about the difficulty of the system but thatbis not what this topic is about. Your general post would be better as either its own topic or actually posted in a topic where thebtopic of conversation is about making the system easier.

It is just like this comment would make no sense in a post stating that the stralth system around certain types of armour is unrealistic (like how chainmail can somehow be silent).

#83

I get it dude and i dont care

#84

Obviousely, which is why no one ever takes people like you seriously. If one can not even post in an appropriate location for their ides/opinions, how can anyone ever take them seriously. You might as well be scribling stuff about China in a bathroom stall in the US. The first step to conversation is being heard by the right people, but they cant hear you when you are yelling in the wrong place.

#85

I absolutely DESPISE this lockpicking system. I literally cannot pass the tutorial no matter how many times I try. It’s torturously and unnecessarily difficult. I would have an easier time picking a lock IRL. I am completely dreading playing any missions that require lockpicking or pickpocketing. They really need to do something about this cuz it’s ruining the game for casual console players. I play Witcher 3 on Death March with no problems but I can’t get past an easy lock in a frickin tutorial in this game. I get going for realism but the whole system is nothing like real lockpicking anyway. You don’t rush thru it or fail and shake like crazy. Ugh, these mechanics and bugs are ruining a game I really want to love.

#86

I have to agree 100% with the assessment of the forum design.

It is illogical and cumbersome. Novelty wore off almost immediately.

#87

Ya i know what you mean, but an update is on its way soon which is supposed to helo with the lockpicking difficulty. Although i havent really had any problem with the pick pocketing as of yet, i havent done it a ton but i have been fairly successful.

My tip for it would be to wait for people to go to sleep, and in the beginning only go for one item at a time, this way you dont need to hold the button down for very long and so you have much less of a risk of being caught. I am on xbox by the way. I have a feeling as my character get more pick pocketing levels then it will be easier to go for longer amounts of time and so i will be able to get multiple items at once. But for the beginning since you can just keep going back into their pockets, you can do one item at a time in order to level up.

I am glad lockpicking is being addressed though. I understand many people like the idea of it being challanging/hard, and that is fine, but something like that should scale appropriately. Yes henry is new to lockpick so he wouldnt be very good at it, but easy and very easy locks should not be so annoying to pick since they are meant to be your introduction to the whole system. There is also a fine line between a system being difficult and a system being annoying. It is fine for a system to be somewhat difficult, but when it starts off at very difficult it tends to push people away from ever using that system to begin with. A lockpicking system really shouldnt be one of the hardest things in the entire game, it is meant to be a smaller off shoot mechanic, it is not meant to be something you need to spend hours and hours in real life getting good at. It isnt like combat which is a system which is a focal point of the entire game.

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