Playable female characters!

I concur.

KC:D was supposed to be a realistic, first person, historical game set in Bohemia 1403 playing as Henry, the son of a blacksmith who’s family was killed. Warhorse said they planned to put killable children into the game, making it the first RPG to be actually realistic without immortallity (read: Important NPCs immortal cliche, but not children/other people.)

KC:D is now a 1st/3rd person game set in Bohemia 1403 playing as Henry and ‘‘Henryetta’’ a.k.a. the Miller’s daughter. Children have been removed/made immortal so they aren’t sued, taking away from their plan for a realistic game.

Warhorse has changed a lot from its Kickstarter plan and we all live with it. But to completely change their vision of the game for female characters and custom creation? Might as well remake Skyrim with better graphics if that’s what you want @whizkid

theres no third person that already got shut down.

@DrFusselpulli A particularly interesting case is brewing: Prior to the rise of the guilds beginning later in the 15th century, brewing was all but exclusively a woman’s industry in Western Europe.

@SirWarriant No, they weren’t common. But VIRTUALLY 0 is still more than 0. There were VERY small numbers of exceptional figures throughout Europe (IE Agnes Hotot, who fought a duel in her father’s place, unhorsing and defeating her opponent).

From a 1348 British Chronicle:

When the tournaments
were held, in every place a company of ladies appeared in the the
diverse and marvelous dress of a man, to the number sometimes of about
forty, sometimes fifty, ladies from the more handsome and more
beautiful, but not the better ones of the entire kingdom; in divided
tunics, with small hoods, even having across their stomachs, below the
middle, knives which they vulgarly called daggers placed in pouches from
above. Thus they came on excellent chargers or other horses splendidly
adorned, to the place of tournament. And in such manner they spent and
wasted their riches and injured their bodies with abuses with ludicrous
wantoness.’

There was also the Breton pirate Jeanne de Clisson. Pope Boniface VIII discussed several Genoese women who fought in the crusades.

Because Player Characters are by their nature exceptional individuals (Henry may not be leading the army, but he’ll certainly be doing a heck of a lot better for himself than one would expect from a humble blacksmith during this era), a case CAN be made that would justify it. However as I will reiterate:

A female character in Henry’s position would face SIGNIFICANTLY more challenges than a man. At best she would face constant ridicule from both men AND other women for not minding her place. At worst she may risk assault (physical AND sexual) and murder. It would be much more difficult for her to be taken seriously both on side-quests and the main plot.

And THIS is why Warhorse shouldn’t make a female character option: Not because a female in the role would be a complete and total impossibility, but because they can’t afford the development time and money to do it PROPERLY would require. It’s NOT a matter of just swapping out pronouns. A female character following the same plot, even if the STORY stays the same, will still nonetheless face additional challenges a man wouldn’t.

@whizkid The main person making the rude remarks is you, and you’re dismissing everything everyone has tried to tell you. Someone can only repeat themselves so many times, and people get very frustrated arguing with a brick wall. I thought I’ve made myself clear that, were it practical, I WOULDN’T mind a female protagonist, but NOT if they half-ass is. I’d want them to do it RIGHT, and that would take almost entirely different NPC interactions (IE, nobles who interact with Henry one way might very well take a…different sort of interest in Henrietta). NOR would I want them to do it at the expense of crafting a deep and meaningful story for Henry.

Even AAA publishers face the same obstacles. And those who WOULD be capable, would still make generic “one-size-fits-all” NPC interactions entirely because they’d be afraid of the outcry if a female character had a much more difficult gameplay experience than a male (put it this way: Think of how pissed off people would be if someone were to make a game set Reconstruction South with a black protagonist who would be treated how blacks were ACTUALLY treated, not our uber-PC can’t offend anybody Disney Theme Park version).

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Brewing was in the hand of woman, pretty interesting. I have czeched ( :wink: ) that, it seem to be true. Yes, this maybe could make an interesting game, a roleplaying game not about fights, but about the possibility to manage a bruwery, with the focus on economy and intrigue. Sadly this is really niche, maybe we could se a mod about it. I would be interested.

Well that makes it sound far, far worse than it was. Women were worse of then than today, but there is no need to demonize the Middle Ages. While it did vary from place to place, throughout Europe women would often be paid the same wages as men for the same work, they weren’t stuck in a home all day “slaving” over a hot stove, they held jobs are were paid for it

@DrFusselpulli I believe in that in Bohemia women were also in charge of beehives and honey.

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[quote=“TheKnightinBlack, post:51, topic:22080, full:true”]
Warhorse said they planned to put killable children into the game, making it the first RPG to be actually realistic without immortallity (read: Important NPCs immortal cliche, but not children/other people.)[/quote]

Where are you getting this from? Kickstarter page never mentions children once.

In the comments section Warhorse did reply to a comment asking about children in which they stated the following.


.
This wasn’t made an official announcement presumably because they weren’t sure if it would be possible to implement it. Which we now know they won’t be adding them because of the following-


.
Google translate isn’t the greatest but what can be gathered from this is

A. Killable children while being realistic breeds lawsuits and social outcry

B. Immortal children would break immerision and would cause orphan scenarios

C. they believe they found a solution to the issue but they don’t have the people (time/Money to do so)

Its the same issue with a female storyline it would bring money in for sure but, they don’t have they time or money to do such things. Limitations yo.

Please if you chose to rebuttal to this part of this post in particular continue it here as to not Derail from this threads topic.

[quote=“TheKnightinBlack, post:51, topic:22080, full:true”]
KC:D is now a 1st/3rd person game set in Bohemia 1403…[/quote]

Nope it is still a 1st person only RPG and will remain so until an official announcement from the WarHorse is made.

Care to share these changes? I know of a few but you haven’t mentioned one so far that is true.

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Well there WAS 3rd person, but now I’m hearing they booted it.

Female Character is now added.

Children, which as we’ve both been discussing on the other post about this issue.

Player Housing.

Those are all new that weren’t part of the original Kickstarter.

No man there legitimately never was going to be a TPFOV the community was asked what they wanted, the vote was divided and so they decided to stick with the original plan of FPV only,

Again never officially announced.


.
Been apart of the FAQ since near the beginning so no this isn’t a new change.

Eh well, I said what I knew and wished to say.

Im saying lets not do this. I know that it would be only for those, who would exchange historical correctness (and logic) for that option and others would be unaffected, right?

But I don’t think it is a good way. They try to offer a story in medieval world they trying to be as authentic as possible. This would be gimmick that would deny the whole point (unless they would make whole new story for her - which has been mentioned milion times).

PS I believe it is not the reason that we stuck at 2,3. And also if you are reconsidering your support becouse few harsh comments on forum, calling the comunity toxic… then perhaps you are a bit oversensitive.

How dare you make rape jokes and calling rape “most hilarious shit ever” or “oh no moment”? If rape in a game is classified as an “oh no moment”, it is as much of a fantasy game as a game with dragons.

Lara Croft is called “Lara Croft”. Same as “Batman” being Batman. Those kind of games have no character customization, they include only one protagonist. Kingdom Come: Deliverance does have character customization, meaning you make your own character. I see absolutely no reason why it would be impossible, and I absolutely can’t see why it would be less exciting, to play as a female character.

Tomb Raider doesn’t include character customization. And men tend to sexualize Lara Croft anyway, showing that they’re obviously not immersing into the game, they’re viewing it as something a woman is doing. Oh, and men can be raped as well. Again, I’m not saying Tomb Raider should include Larry Croft, because the game doesn’t have character customization.

And how incredibly unimaginative do you have to be to believe a female protagonist in a medieval world limits the storyline and gameplay options? For real?

If your main goal with playing this game is to play something that has been made a thousand times before, why did you choose this game? I want to play KC:D because it seemed innovative. The only reason why they haven’t included the option to play as a female is because they don’t want you to play as a female. You can play as a fat dude, being as swift as the slimmest of the others, but not female…

Henry is a blacksmith’s son. Blacksmiths don’t fight on the battlefield, it’s absurd that he would. Yet that’s what he ends up doing, and that’s why the story is interesting. It would be easy for Warhorse to add a female character with it’s full storyline, they simply haven’t been convinced to.

Really a blacsmith is more common on battlefield than a women at that time, and yes there were few rare on here and there but they would deserve their story to be told but devs have made story for Henry around real events and that’s it. They even told so on when you were giving your money for this game…

I think you might be mistaken here. You play Henry in KCD. You cannot adjust his face or physique (they have hinted you might be able to change his hair and facial hair). You can adjust his clothes.

But this is not character customization in the sense that Skyrim is, for example.

This story is about a male protagonist. Period. This topic should be closed.

This game isn’t like Skyrim, Fallout, or Mass Effect, in regards to character customization. Its character customization is more like Assassin’s Creed. They are making a game that tells a specific story. If you want to have more character customization, this isn’t that game. No one is forcing you to play this game. I don’t understand why this debate keeps going on, like KCD is obligated to include females. That’s really rude to what they’re trying to do. They have enough challenges already. They don’t need to feel guilty because a select few are up in arms because they can’t play as a woman in a game that is trying to be realistic and historically accurate. It’s just an absurd and selfish argument.

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It does not limit the story line. It presents different challenges. So different that just switching genders would not work. For example unknown male can be quite believably be hired by local lord to chase some bandits. Unfamiliar female on the other hand wouldn’t be even considered. It doesn’t mean that she can’t go after them but that if she wants to go after the bandits, she must do so on her own. At least at the start and later when she has some reputation she again faces vastly different environment, based on the prejudices and expectation of people around her. Yes it may be interesting story, but it is not the story @warhorse wants to tell in this game. And I don’t think that it diminishes value of the story.

If you want to tell me that the difference between how people treat man and women is not that big than just let me count the number of times I was told: “You can’t do that, you are female.” (I don’t remember every single instance, but I heard it more than once or twice.) And there is lot more acceptance for women stepping out of traditional roles than it was five hundred years ago.
Also as far as I understood lot of character customization in this games comes mostly from wearing different clothes or hairstyles. Also your choices may possibly affect your physique. I don’t think there will be some slider to set up your characters face, body type etc.
And finally you have to understand the difference between sandbox game and story driven game. This is story driven game. Yes there is open world and the story is advertised as nonlinear, but it still is not a sandbox game.

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I know. But really, developing the game’s infrastructure, physics engine, all of the research etc. etc. costs much more than writing a believable storyline. They could write one that follows the same tracks but with many different interactions, with a female character, much easier than their non-linear storyline that they’ve already said they’re making. You can make choices along the way that leads to a different story; it is quite obvious that even though it costs time and money to expand on the story, they have enough of both.

I am a man, and I felt tons of extra connection to Henry when I first saw his face; his default appearance even looked like me. If I can feel that kind of immersion in a great game like this, I feel pity for the nearly 50% of all gamers who can’t. Oh, and yes, women do make up a massive amount of today’s gamers.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_video_games#Female_gamers_as_a_demographic

But they aren’t trying to appeal to the masses. They are trying to make a very niche game. Obviously they want it to be successful, but this game is inherently targeting a very specific audience. If a female gamer cannot get excited about what they’re trying to do because she cannot play as a woman, then this just isn’t the game for her, and they’re under no obligation to appeal to her. They are trying to tell a specific story, and if she doesn’t want a part of it, then that’s that. They shouldn’t be compelled to accommodate. That’s really unfair. Should they include transgender playable characters to? Black people? Maybe the main character should be homosexual? How bout a Mexican medieval blacksmith? … You get my point, I hope…

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Actually this could be very interesting. Following a story of a Czech soldier who starts war with the Austrian army but soon defects and joins the free Czechoslovak army in the East, then when the Great War is over keeps fighting Bolsheviks, control the Transsiberian railroad, and then takes a year to get back to the homeland, which is now a free country.

Also, one of my favorite badass historical figures is Josef Šnejdárek.

Started in Austrian army in 1895. He was bored so he went to see what a war is like between Turks and Greeks on holidays.

Then joined French foreign legion and fought for years in Africa. Then got into the Great War in Europe and was few times injured.

Got back to Czechoslovakia and first won war against Poland and then against Hungary.

Playing this guy would be ultimate bad-assary.

you clearly have no idea about game development.
It would be a lot for work… all cutsenses, all conversations would need to be in two versions both the text and the full voice acting. That is not something you do in an afternoon

And they would be break the promish they made about making a historical game.

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