Combat "Discussion" - Dev Spotted


#241

Could you explain what you mean? I´m confused…


#242

The horse riding in first person, it’s not pretty.


#243

HOW??? Or maybe better to not explain, I think I dont want to know… Btw those eyes… :smiley:

Carter Menashe: how is it game breaking to you?


#244

Well it’s something like if someone wanted me to eat shit and promised me a 100€ (the story and other parts of the game) for it. It’s just something you don’t want to do, even if you would like the 100€.

This has happened before. For example, I probably would enjoy the Witcher otherwise, but because of the shitty combat and controls I had to quit the game completely after about 5 minutes, same with Dragon Age. I have no interest in playing these games without engaging in combat either, if that’s even possible.
But I’m not really upset about this, so need for anyone to be upset about what I say.

Or were you more interested in the details of what I think is bad about the combat?


#245

Yes i was more curious about details…


#246

I am more curious of what you consider good combat system, as highly RPG based in DAO obviously doesn´t work for you, and highly action and combo based in witcher 3 also doesn´t suit you…


#247

Ok the combat isn’t as bad with keyboard and mouse anymore, but it’s still not very good and with joystick it’s still game breaking.

@Tsunamik I’ve said about that in other threads…


#248

I am quite amazed by this thread!!

I recently tried the beta for the 1st time, and stopped playing it immediately after the 1st fight (there’s a guy in a mineshaft and 3 opponents come to end us), because I was sure the combat system was bugged and out of order.

Reading you all makes me believe that this awfull lock and target system are working as intended, and that frankly horrifies me.

I tried this fight like 10 times (both with keyboard+mouse and gamepad), and at best I could kill one of the folks (because I can kill him before the AI reacts to me), but… seriously? I’m always locked on the wrong target, then I manage to do it some dmg by miracle, and the targets shifts on its own?

I’m a big M&B player and a lot of you mentions this game as reference, but I feel absolutely no relation there due to this lock and targeting system. The forced permanent 1st person view also changes it all because I never know if my character is actually trying to block/parry, or not.

I really thought naively that as the game is in beta I’ll just have to wait for some patches to see a working combat system, but if you guys are able to manage as it is, I think I suck at it, and prolly won’t play this game ever again.
It’s the same with the 3 witcher games : i bought the 3 on gog, really tried them for hours, and really wanted to love them, but I couldn’t go by the controls and combat system :’(

So unless there’s a way to play it with diplomatics only and never fighting (but I doubt this might be an option), I might not play KCD again :frowning:


#249

Hello @Vaark,
go first to the arena (soldier camp) and make some training fights. It makes no sense to discuss the combat if don’t know the basics.:blush:
It’s like taking about speed limit and manual gearshift without having a driving license and never driven a car before. Yes you can but it sounds… strange at least.
In the quest log you can find this helpful quest (sword training) and it’s marked on the map.
This fight system is not only button smashing and not easy against multiple NPCs.


#250

Hi Bsmith,

The fact is I did take the lessons with the guy hitting in slow motion to learn parries and the rest, but I never was able to go through even one combo with my gamepad, and that’s one of the reasons why I though the combat system was broken.

And even those practices were awfully hard for me to go through (might be related with the fact that I picked the diplomatic character setup), but the real gamebreaker for me was this multiple opponents fight with the lock and auto-target system.

Also, for your analogy, I’m quite confident any European adult without a driving licence would be way more able to speak about manual gearshift than most of licenced US citizens :wink:


#251

Hi Vaark,

I can understand your frustration, but be patient :slight_smile: Combos are currently very hard to pull-off, I have about 20 hours of practice in arena, and still can do them only with like 60% success rate :smiley: Luckily, they are not necessary for winning a fight, feinting and parry timing are MUCH more important currently.

Also yes - diplomatic setup makes fighting VERY hard in my opinion, I tried diplomatic in arena and fighter in arena, and man, what a difference. Especially parrying is almost impossible as diplomat, and I couldn´t even perform the easiest combo. So try fighter setup next time, get some practice in arena, and you will see its not that bad.

For lock and autotarget system - you are in fact right about this. Its not finished, and switching targets reliably is impossible right now, especially on gamepad. So yes, this will be addressed in the future I think, probably by some extra control for switching target on the flow, or some automated system, which allows you to defend and counterattack against closest/currently attacking enemy or something.
But it really doesn´t feel like final version, so don´t worry - while lock system will probably stay, changing targets and overall experience should improve drastically.

So overall - yes basics of system are probably set, its those tweaks and balancing which needs to be finished, and I believe that all your issues might be dealth with.

  • RPG systems are there, so you just need to tailor your character according to your needs after release.
  • Locking system must be and will be improved, so you can fight multiple enemies (and not fight just your control scheme) - it still won´t be easy tho, be warned!
  • And lot of your issues will be resolved with little bit of training - or lowering your difficulty settings :slight_smile:

#252

Hooray!
Here comes the hope! :wink:

I read dozens times in here that the combat system was where the team put most of its efforts, and was afraid it would remain as it is now because most of you guys seem to handle it.
Although I think I definitely hate the “lock” system, I’ve been dreaming of working directions based attacks/parries fights since the attempts made in Age of Conan and M&B Warband.

Playing video games for ~25 years now, I don’t have any problem with difficult fights or reloading after a game over, but it did look impossible to win the fight by the mineshaft with my gamepad and the diplomatic setup.
Being the 1st fight met in this beta, and knowing that I can’t picture myself playing something else than a “swift tong / diplomatic” character, it was indeed frustrating, but I’ll keep looking for updates in this regard if you tell me they’ll improve it.

I’d definitely love to love this game.


#253

The combat in Witcher 3, while not my favorite or perfect by any stretch, I thought was actually quite easy and sometimes very satisfying. I can’t remember what difficulty I played on, but it was NOT on Easy. I don’t consider myself to be a amazing gamer by any stretch, but I’m able to beat any game on Normal or Hard setting. I struggle with Very Hard and “I’m a masochist” settings haha

So I would suggest giving it another go. Witcher 3 has a really good story and dialogue system. Plus the game gets better the deeper you get into it.


#254

I found Witcher 2 combat to be much more challenging than 3. And even then, by the end of my first play-through on Normal, I was ready and able to beat the game on Dark Mode.

I suck at Dark Souls / Hardcore games and modes… so my point being as Pengman says, sounds like you just needed to give it more time and effort. A brilliant series of games, well worth playing.


#255

Well when talking about combat i think its a bit of a shame that when hitting an enemy there is no sound of him screaming of being hurt neither when they are killed. They just fall to the ground like a doll. I hope they will add some sounds as it feels a bit dull.


#256

What is available to us to play as backers at present, is in no true way indicative of the current state of the game.

Which is both good and bad. It’s bad because it means we can’t experience all facets and mechanics of KCD just yet. But it’s good in that we’ve had guarantees that the game is far more mature in development terms currently than we have access to.

Where concerns like those would most certainly already have been addressed.


#257

Well thats very true, and i want to say that it was only something i mentioned because i hope it will be added to the finished game. The same thing with the enemy just falling the ground like dolls when killed could maybe be addressed with a few different killinganimations.
Its just that to me, it adds something to the experience of the game. And somehow makes you feel that youre actually struggling for your life and try to keep yourself alive against different enemies. And if you manage to do that, you will be awarded with a great feeling when piercing your enemy with a sword.

So hopefully it will be added to the finished game.
Other than that i really like KCD it is an awesome game, and a game i have been looking forward to in many years now. Its a great work being done here and i am sure the finished game will be totally awesome.


#258

I feel sick after dueling all three difficulties at the ‘‘army’’ camp . You should realy tone down the camera movement in combat imo.


#259

Combat is still quite difficult but I think I am starting to master it…definitely need to get used to my positions.


#260

Alright folks, its time to change the whole thing!