Equipping Polearms

There is a mod on NexusMods, named as “Restore Halberds”, it works good, for people who wants “gameplay over realism” in this particular aspect.

note: For me realism as possible is essential in this game, but when it enter in conflict with “gameplay and mechanics” I cannot like (I like big bu… polearms).

Is not very realistic having a “in sync” stash container either (this is for masters of “immersion”) besides I like using halberds kindly against patrols of Cumans :smiley:

For me realism as possible is essential in this game

Then you shouldn’t use at all the auto sync stash (i don’t, and it’s not hard when you have a horse and a couple safe stashes where you put stuff and go back picking when you need). And mainly you shouldn’t use swords untill you’re a rich nobleman :wink:
Polearms are really necessary for this game’s historical accuracy, and there are WAY too many swords around in this game, which is a lot disappointing to me…

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exaclty… i would like to play as a normal guy who is in Radzigs service. Started with just gambeson, bascinet and some polearm and just upgrade my gear as I will continue with story (add chainmail, padded leg amror, then first plate piece, ect.)

I want to try to solve the polearms problem with the mod, but i am not sure if it will works… do anyone have any experience with the mod?

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@TarekJor ,
Just for the record, you don’t throw spears, you throw javelins. While these look much alike at first glance, they are built totally different and not interchangeable, especially due to their different points of balance. You can’t melee well if at all with a javelin, and you can’t throw a spear much if at all.

But as to polearms in general, while I think they were unarguably a major thing for this time period (from quarterstaff on up to halberds), and while I wish they were in the game for that reason, I also recognize that the existing combat mechanics just don’t work for them. So WH would have to make a whole new combat system for polearms just so you could use them with the same sort of realistic-ish moves that we have with swords and such. This system would then have to have its own interface and so on, with its own trainers for new players., AND on top of this, you’d have to tweak the existing melee system to correctly handle polearm vs. sword-like things in all their combinations in a coherent manner.

Oh well, that’s something we’ll hopefully see in DLC someday. They appear to have started on this already, which is why there’s some thing for the “Restore Halberds” mod to work with. But I tried that mod and thought it just made a terrible mess out of combat, so I’ll do without polearms for now.

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Good points, @Barnack :wink:
I refer Realism as interesting gameplay mechanics, “not insanity” or “very intensive”, to be clear :D.
This is a game after all, for example about the stash “in sync” (if a mod emerges, or a independent container system is released with a major patch, with own lockpicks and keys, chances to be robbed), I think will be good.

On topic, about polearms and horses, I would “sacrifice” some Realism accuracy to equip and carry polearms, and for more enemies on horse (horse were the Ferrari of that time, I think), expensive and a class symbol, like you said with swords.), but as is a personal decision (customize my game), I understand, some people disagree.

@Bullethead, you are right, polearms and javelins are not the same, related but different, for me horse combat with polearms is a good way to kill Cumans :D, but I agree with you “in house” development is needed to adjust combat mechanics, animations, etc becasue Restore Halberds mod seems very WIP as you said, but it works (for people who ask) @korbel05 , at least to test.

@TarekJor what you mean “i’d sacrifice Realism to equip and carry polearms”? Equipping polearms instead of swords IS Realism. Equipping swords to a poor guy instead of a polearm, that’s insanely unreal!

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It’s Common misunderstanding that only the rich would have swords…There are so many different types and some of them are simply Used by commoners. Although there should be more axes and so forth beeing Used.
The realism Problem with polearms he’s talking about is that you can’t Just fit one in your Pocket. There would be need for a while new mechanic to “sheath” your polearm meaning you Just Walk around with it using it basicly as a walking stick Like in Gothic 3. Also, AS stated above, the current fighting system doesnt make Sense for polearms, the KI wouldnt handle them that Well too i think.and a Spear actually would be kinda OP in the current state (what it actually is irl too, But for Gamedesign its Just Bad If the Most simple weapon is the best).

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I mean, ability to “carry” polearms
and take them, to my inventory, to horse inventory (I know polearms are large and big weapons), not only take and drop when I change to bow (for example), so equip unequip, that is not realistic, but it is fun.

A spear loses all its op-ness once your opponent gets past the tip. Hard to implement though

Well right now we can hide an entire armory in our horse’s saddlebag lol

You can, But you don’t have to. :wink:

Yeah, ofc IT dies, But really even If you’re untrained you stand a good Chance to keep an oponent at distance with a Spear.

It’s more complicated than that… Using a spear in a 1-on-1 fight as opposed to being part of a phalanx/shield wall is a totally different thing not handled well by the game right now.

The main problem with polearms in the game is that the existing combat system treats them as sort of extra-long longswords. That is, you hold them with both hands at the rear and and swing and stab with them same as any other 2-handed weapon. But this method is only realistic if you’re part of a massed formation. In a 1-on-1 fight, which is what we always have in KCD as nobody holds formation, these mechanics are totally wrong.

In a 1-on-1 fight, you hold a polearm with your hands spread apart on either side of the point of balance. You usually block with the section of shaft between your hands, and you can attack with both ends, both of which can slash and stab. IOW, it’s something of a dual-wield technique using only 1 weapon, and the existing combat system simply can’t do this at all. And that’s just considering the basic moves. On top of this, many polearms had hooks to trip opponents or yank them off horses. Using these adds a whole new type of attack, happening on pulling back instead of thrusting forward.

Bottom line: Doing polearms to a similar level of realism as the other weapons requires making a whole new combat system just for them. WH apparently didn’t have time/money available to do this with the initial release, so polearms aren’t really a thing in the game right now. So I recommend leaving them alone until WH can do them right.

That’s exactly the point of a spear. A plate armor or a shield with some basic skills would be enough to get rid of it though

No need you to tech me, i practice HEMA :wink:
Doing polearms wouldn’t require THAT much changing.
Sword-like thrusts, mace-like “cuts” or whatever the game wants to call them.
The hard things i can think of are:

  1. “cut” movement damage depending on distance for any polearm with an edge (if i hit the enemy with the edge part cut damage, else crush damage)
  2. that’s the really hard one: different moves for dealing with opponents closer than optimal reach. That’d require stuff like scripted combos which have to be unlocked with high skill - a noob spearman is f****d when the enemy gets too close, a skilled and trained one knows how to deal with it.

Note:
you don’t Always parry with the section between your hands, it would mean you’re letting your opponent close the distance, which is something you really wouldn’t want to happen.

I dunno. With most polearms, you can both slash and stab with either end as desired, and many allow pulling on at least 1 end as well. The existing system doesn’t allow for this at all. In the existing system, you have only 1 “end” and can select slash or stab with LMB or RMB. But with 2 ends to worry about, you need a way to specific which end to use and then how to attack with it, which might have 3 choices instead of just 2.

I suppose you could tweak the existing system so that the central star has 3 points, 3 on each side, and moving the mouse to one side or the other would specify the end to attack with. Then you could use LMB, RMB, and even CMB for the type of attack to do with that end.

Ya know… If they do something like this, they could apply the polearm mechanics to using a longsword against a guy in plate armor. That’s an improvement I’m sure most HEMA folks would love to see. It’s kinda silly to use moves intended for soft targets on hard targets :slight_smile:

No, not always, but it happens a lot. In general, you don’t want to block too far from your hands because the farther out you make contact, the more leverage the enemy has on you. So it’s often worth your while to step inside yourself. Not only does this give you a stronger block, it helps keep you inside the reach of his hook coming back on you after the block.

Let’s suppose you wield your spear on your right, with the left hand forwards.
All slash motion Attacks from left to right and from up to down will occur with the tip of the weapon. Slash motion Attacks from right to left will occur with the opposite tip and necessairly deal less damage to. All we’d need is just a button to change stance (F? R? There are so many unused buttons in your keyboard). The animations would be the same, just mirrored, so no more work to be done.
In real life slash motion is rarely used, all you’d do is keep distance and frantically spam well aimed (or less well aimed, depending on the person) quick thrusts which focus more on precision and annoyment than on power. Slashing with a polearm (except halberd-like ones) is stupidly risky because it means you’re allowing your opponent to get inside and control your space. The main defence with a spear is keeping your opponent on the other side of the tip.

About parrying, you should really watch some videos, most parries are done with the section between the forward hand and the tip, and are done against other polearm wielders. Because when a shorter weapon is close enough for you to need to parry, your spear is already mostly fucked

Note: techniques change a lot depending on who you’re fighting. Spear vs spear and spear vs sword are two totally different matters


Parrying with the section between your hands is either desperate or hollywood
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Not sure if this helps but I use the pole arms alot and though you can’t store them you can leave them in any of your player homes for safe keeping except Miller’s house cuase they have sticky fingers but I have a polearm in each tavern they seem to stay there indefinitely

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According to: https://kingdomcomedeliverance.wiki.fextralife.com/Polearms+and+Spears the game has both, a Lucerne Hammer and Runt’s Club. I assume they pull all that info from the game’s files.

Does anyone know where to get either of them? I assume Runt’s disappears when you go back, but has anyone found the Lucerne Hammer, or Runt’s Club for that matter?

In the fight during the story with him (2nd time, not in Skalitz) he has a sword…

I was very much expecting to fight him again with him having a club, but when I saw the sword I thought to myself “that must be the sword he stole”. Turns out that isn’t the case…but that also really doesn’t explain why he ditched the giant club to begin with.

As for your actual question, i’m sure they’re items pulled from game files that are not intended for player use. They had to give his club stats, so a data-miner CAN pull the files with those stats…but unfortunately you can never find the item.

I’d so go around the countryside smashing people with it if I could get it, which is likely why he has a sword in the second fight =)

I’m more interested in the hammer than the club. I’d even be happy to cheat it in. If you watch the cinematic, he drops the club when he runs away. It makes sense. You can’t sprint with polearms, or giant clubs.

Edit: It turns out you can cheat them in, including the club and hammer. At least on PC. I’m still interested in a legit way if anyone knows one.

Cheat URL: https://www.nexusmods.com/kingdomcomedeliverance/mods/106