Mod support for PCs?


#21

@Fallen_Angel - So your point is that you don’t like to buy anything without trying them first?

Not even a game for example?

I purchased Kingdom Come without ever playing it or even watching a review. I purchased it because I listened to the developer and what they said sounded good. So I took a chance on it… If it turns out to be great then I made a good choice. If not… then I will learn from it and move along. That is all I would ever ask anyone to do with any mod that I worked on.


#22

Mods should be free with the option to donate. And we can see the problem with charging for mods people over charging and not making any money from their mods. $10 for a few horse is just silly $0.50 would be a better price and create a hell of lot more sales and revenue but wont work in a single player game. Adding a cash shop to a single player game which sells cosmetic goods just won’t work mods such as yours just wont make money the only ones which will make money are ones that add quests and increase the length of the game.


#23

Hello again :smiley:

it is quite different to go to a games shop and buy a complete game which have been reviewed by the press or just a modification of a game which will alter the gameplay or add new features to it.
Pledging on Kickstarter doesn’t mean you “buy” a game, it does mean that you are supporting the development of a game and the developer are granting you access to it (there are no rules that you have to do so, but most will do it that way to honor the donators)

If I decide to buy a game I am always reading reviews about them and decide after that if I am going to invest money or not.

Only few mods are going to get that attention of professional reviewers and it is hard to decide for “customers” if it will be a good deal or not or in the worst case you would be buying something that won’t even work. In that case you would have to write modders everytime for a refund if their work won’t work. I think it is just not possible to do it that way and the only way to go is to offer mods for free so others can use them (if they like too) and let them decide how much money they will offer you. Otherwise every modder would have to create a company with an place of jurisdiction to protect customers. That would cost even more money and work that it would be worth in my mind. Especially in some countries in the world you would have a customer protection on buying software that does not work or promise false things to the customers… it is very complicated especially for me because I am not a native English speaker.

So don’t make things unnecessarily complicated and let the users decide if they want to pay you something to honor your work, or not or how much. Everyone would be happy and the game itself would benefit because moddable games stay longer on the market and will get a larger community over the time.

But if you really want money for your work you will have to set up your own stuff and sell them there. Fans of your work will buy your products but you would have a much smaller community who are using them.


#24

@hidude - Should the work you do for a living be free and your boss have an option to donate to you? I would like to see that happen even if it was just for a year so that you realize how silly your argument is.

Where I come from we have shops that set prices and people either buy things there or they don’t. You can’t try everything out before you buy them and if products don’t sell then usually the price drops or the shop closes. We don’t believe in price fixing because it is bad for competition and harms creativity and ingenuity. The best products sell and the bad ones don’t. I don’t see why that is so hard to understand unless you come from a communist country.

The days of developers and artists getting nothing in return for their hard work are coming to an end. If you don’t like it then don’t buy any mods. I understand that some people are used to getting things for free in the past and that having to pay for them now might come as a shock.

Also I don’t know who is charging $10 for a few horses and I don’t know why you are saying “Mods such as yours” when I clearly have not made anything for this game yet. I used a horse as an example of a possible mod only and $10 as an example of a top price for a good mod. I never said I was selling three horses for $10. We don’t even know if we can sell mods for any price yet. Who said I was not planning to do extra quests for the game? You are coming up with a lot of assumptions from thin air and saying them as if they are fact.

All I am advocating is having the option to sell mods. Nothing else.


#25

Have a look at how iTunes works for developers who make the hundreds of thousands of apps for iOS. This is how mods will be sold in the future and has proven to be incredibly successful for Apple. It is the main reason Apple is doing so well. If Apple said all the apps had to be given away for free how many less developers would there be developing for iOS?

A developer makes an app that they think the community will like and then they submit it to Apple for a review. The app needs to meet quality standards and follow specific guidelines set by Apple. If the app is good enough it goes on sale and Apple take a cut of the sale and this covers their costs for the review process. Warhorse can do the same as Apple just as other game company’s are starting to do.

No one wants to buy an app/mod that is crap or does not work. That is why we have online rating systems and anyone can write a review. If you ignore the ratings and reviews and buy a bad app/mod then you have no one else to blame and can post a review saying the app/mod was crap.


#26

Yes, it could be the future if some online platform is willing to provide that kind of service. I am not quite into that app-scene because thats kind of stuff does my husband for me :smile:

If there will be a platform which offers the service of reviews and kind of stuff then I think it will be better deal for everyone because not everyone is going to honor the skills and time of a modding person.

But I do think that this platform has to be something specialized into that kind of products with experts because the traffic for downloading some kind of mods is amazing.

Maybe the modders themself will set up a platform like this in some time if they are getting the support of a wealthy person who could set up something like that.

The only thing I am asking for is fairness for every party. :smiley: Hm… I am guessing it’s sometimes a little weird when I am writing in English, but I hope everyone still understand


#27

I think we are both agreeing that we all want it to be fair to everyone and safe. It is possible that Steam could be used for selling and reviewing mods as it is already been done there for other games and we know that Warhorse will be available on Steam.

It is something for the developers to think about and in the end they will do what is best for their game.


#28

Look i get where you coming from but on a game like this which is a niche market modders wouldn’t make near enough to support themselves. It works on Dota as Dota has a huge market for which modders can advertise their mods too. You just wouldn’t make enough money as the market is not big enough.


#29

I’d be grateful for whatever modding tools we get, if any. Even if we don’t it hasn’t stopped modders in the past so why would it now? I also don’t like the idea of purchasable mods, I’d much rather have something similar to Skyrim’s modding.


#30

moved to newly created Modding category


#31

@Kiwi

Just out of interest, what’s to stop someone from downloading your mod, pulling it apart to figure out how it works and then doing the same thing and selling it cheaper (or even just uploading it on a torrent site for free)?

I don’t know, I’m not really keen on the idea of paying for mods. I certainly wouln’t have bothered with mods in Skyrim if I had to pay for each and every single one of them. If they all cost $10 each then that would have cost me well over $1000 just to do my last playthrough.

Yes, they take a lot of time to make BUT I think you will find that a lot of modders are willing do this in their spare time as a hobby and not as a job.


#32

@InvisibleShadow - There is nothing to stop anyone from doing a similar mod and I have no problem with it so long as they create all their own content (stories, models and textures etc).

I agree that there will always be people that pirate games and mods and there is little anyone can do to stop them but that does not force game and movie company’s to give their services away for free. Some people are honest and if they like the look of a product are willing to pay for it. That is to be expected these days. I am currently living in China for a couple of years and almost everything here is pirated.

I know that in the past there has been a lot of talented people willing to donate their time to make mods for free and that has been great for everyone. We get new mods to play and the mod developer gets to learn some things that could lead to a job in the games industry. But just because one person wants to give his work away should not mean that we all have to. And how about all the talented people that already are in the industry? Should they also work for free?

I do understand why people still expect mods to be free. It is because in the past the game assets were a lot simpler and a lot quicker to make compared to today’s game assets and they could be given away without a second thought.

Today models are now so much more detailed and complicated with a lot more research and design needing to go into everything. Adding a horse skin to Skyrim is a small job that would take only a few hours but creating a new horse model from scratch could take weeks of hard work to match the standards set by the rest of the game.

As games become more and more realistic and the amount of work required to make them also continues to go up peoples expectations for free mods are going to have to change.

The way I see it is that if a mod only takes a couple of evenings to do then it should be given to the community for free. But if it takes weeks or months of working late each night then I want the option to be able to sell it for a low fee.


#33

@Kiwi

I don’t disagree with anything you’re saying in regards to game development, games becomes much larger and more complex with every year that passes. But I am not convinced that a pay-per-mod system will work to be honest.

Mods are not apps to be bought from an app store and 1-click installed, they generally require a fair bit of technical knowledge from the end-user to be installed correctly so that they function not only with original software but also work to some extent with the plethora of other mods that are likely being developed. Most of the reason that Skyrim’s modding scene has been so popular these last couple of years has been because of the scope of the game world and therefore the scope of modding potential, but I contend that a great deal of it’s success could also be attributed to the fact it’s mods are free and that the community works together as a whole to make these mods compatible and polished, not just the original creators.

And as an aside, if people are being charged for a software product then would it not be reasonable for them to expect some form of end-user support be included with that purchase, or is that required to be paid for separately?

I’m not saying that you shouldn’t be able to try and charge for your work (there have been a couple of Skyrim modders who tried that path), but for your mod to have a chance of being successful that charge will have to be realistic relative to the wider gaming market and therein lies the problem. Steam currently offers full length AAA titles for the price of $10 or less on many occasions, and even at standard price these titles are still extremely inexpensive. DLC is generally cheaper again, and unlike a mod that is made by fans of the game official DLC is made by the original developers who have the complete range of assets available to them not to mention high quality audio engineering, professional voice actors, full range motion capturing and not least of all a team of highly talented people who are infinitely more familiar with the source material and tools.

Even if you put 100’s of hours into building your mod, if you do decide to charge for it then your direct competition in terms of quality will be the official DLC released for the game and not other free mods. If you believe you (and any others you having working with you) have what it takes to achieve that level of quality then by all means charge for it ( If the mod was truly at that level I would in all likelihood pay for it too :smile: ) .


#34

i agree, i know for a fact there’s quite a few great quality mods out there for different games I would have been happy to pay for


#35

modding=free new content provided by community

paid mods=paid dlc sanctioned by publishers.

valve tried to disguise this with with phrases like “community payback”, but really they’re just exploiting modders and using them to generate extra revenue.

thankfully the chances of this happening with warhorse is nearly zero percent. only huge companies backed by huge publishers pull nickle and dime tactics.

people who want money for mods should find a job with a development studio and stop confusing modding with small business.


#36

I don’t mind modders being able to mod but I in general don’t prefer using them, to me mods feel like “fan” work replacing what was originally created by the creator of said game and I usually prefer to play Vanilla content that was provided by the creator along with said DLC or expansions.

That said I totally don’t mind mods or modders, I just prefer not to use them.


#37

Quality-wise you can’t say that for every game.
Car mods for GTA IV for example are more detailed and have better texures.
And of course they’re modelled after real cars.
There are also some nice sound mods, e.g. for the muscles cars.


#38

This is a good example of where the modder was probably more familiar with source material than the developer, and these are generally really good mods to have.


#39

hope mods will be cross platforms (pc, mac and linux) (probably they will… but)


#40

no. most pc mods are too complex for console anyway