Later GAMES of the trilogy, I think, not the acts of Deliverance . Deliverance will be set in 1403, judging from the logo.
@TOUGHGUY Weren’t you a “Pope” before? I’m completely sure that I saw “Pope” as your badge, now it shows “Peasant”
Yikes, after reading this now I’m somewhat worried. I’m hoping that the developers won’t jump on the bandwagon of being anti theistic, or trying to prove a point that “religion is bad,” or “look at what evil things religion made these people do.” This attitude is pervasive in society just look at “The Simpsons.” However, I think this negative impression of religion is WAY overblown, it happened but it wasn’t endemic and generally speaking the peoples lives were more boring than anything else.
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I don’t think it’s anti-theist. All Christians know about the catholic days of indulgences (which Catholicism is actually a mixture of Christianity and a pagan religion I won’t name or get into here you can believe it or not) as well as their many other crimes against people. Though warhorse is saying they will portray these crimes of Catholicism, but they will also be showing the good people who happen to be catholic and especially the good catholic reformist Jan Hus.
This is kinda off topic but I wanted to share a little bit of history. Originally indulgences were pardons from physical punishment but some of the more corrupt popes began to allow their agents to sell them as means of salvation. Also the catholic church was perverted throughout the dark ages (c. 400-1000 a.d.) by converts (many forced) who held onto some of their pagan practices and ideas. As for religion in the game I think that it is essential in some form.
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As a lay-employee of the Catholic Church I’m glad to hear that the developers won’t be bowing to “political correctness.” The Catholic Church has indeed had quite a few dark periods in its history and it’s important that people understand the bad times so as not to repeat them. Indulgences, in and of themselves, were not necessarily a bad thing as @Paladin pointed out. It was when those greedy clergy began “selling to the highest bidder” so to speak, that it became such a problem. When the everyday person could not find the peace they craved because they couldn’t afford the price of salvation, they were the ones who were hurt. While definitely a horrible period and a great story to tell, I hope the developers also remember there were a lot of good Catholics too. As an institution, the Church has weathered many bad times and deservedly has a certain reputation among other religions or non-believers, but it has also done a lot of good that shouldn’t be forgotten either.
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I really, really hope the stereotypical witchcraft schlock gets left out. Whatever one thinks of the Inquisition, the popular notion of them being involved in witch hunts is without historical basis; their prerogative was against heresy, and charges of witchcraft were commonly viewed by Inquisitors as being little more than absurd peasant superstition. Indeed, as the historian Henry Kamen noted in his excellent study of the Spanish Inquisition, the punishment of witchcraft was almost exclusively enacted by secular authorities and in cases where the Inquisition was involved the death sentence was rare.
The inquisition is more known for their overly zealous persecution of “heritics” than witch hunts.
Joan d’arc was considered a heretic working for the devil and even some accused her of being a witch.
Joan d’arc was considered a heretic working for the devil and even some accused her of being a witch.
Joan of Arc was not tried by the Inquisition. The University of Paris (an institution that, it must be noted, was strongly pro-English in its sentiments) did request that she be tried by Jean Graverent, the Inquisitor of France, but the Burgundians preferred the more lucrative, politically advantageous and more reliable English offer of 10,000 livres in exchange for her. The subsequent trial was understood by just about everyone to be a politically expedient means of saving face after the embarrassing defeats Joan had inflicted on the English. Indeed, the presiding judge, the bishop Pierre Cauchon, was appointed solely because he was an English partisan and in fact had no legal jurisdiction to take the trial. She was most certainly not charged with witchcraft; rather, the prosecution focused on asking her obscure theological questions she would have no hope of answering in the hopes of easily finding her guilty of heresy as a flimsy pretext for executing her. Her trial and execution had nothing to do with witchcraft, very little to do with religion and everything to do with political expediency.
The simple fact is this: the belief in witchcraft that is commonly associated with the medieval period has been vastly exaggerated. In fact, at the Council of Frankfurt in 794 it was decreed that burning people as witches was a crime because witches did not exist, and as such killing them constituted nothing less than murder and those found guilty would be punished by death. This was fully in keeping with older Burgundian and Lombardic law codes that likewise condemned killing suspected “witches” as murder. This understanding of witchcraft as being a superstition remained the norm for both legal and ecclesiastical authorities until the 14th century, at which point we find secular authorities began taking a far more active interest in prosecuting such cases; the Catholic Church didn’t begin taking serious action until 1484 when Pope Innovent VIII released his bull Summis desiderantes (which is arguably closer to the Renaissance than it is to the medieval era), yet even with this act most Inquisitors (especially in Spain and Italy) were extremely skeptical, being convinced it was all popular hysteria with no bearing on reality. Such was the verdict of the Spanish Inquisitor Alonso de Salazar Frias at a trial for witchcraft in 1612 at Navarre. In his own words:
“I have not found the slightest evidence from which to infer that a single act of witchcraft has really occurred… in the diseased state of the public mind every agitation of the matter is harmful and increases the evil [witch-hunting hysteria]. I deduce the importance of silence and reserve from the experience that there were neither witches nor bewitched until they were talked and written about.”
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Here in Denmark the first known case of a witch getting burned was in 1540, just after the reformation.
The last official one was in 1693. But there where cases of lynching later.
Burning witches have nothing to do with the medieval period.
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He downgraded to Peasant because he is dissatisfied with how nudity will be presented in the game
I would really love to see implemented religious features, like the mentioned two popes, excommunications and indulgences. Perhaps even featuring a college of cardinals, because the game is settled in Holy Roman Empire? Religion was a very important factors for rulers, because being disfavored by the clergy and the pope (who had enormous worldly influence) could lead to a loss of power really quick.
As a Christian (not a Catholic though) I also hope they don’t sink into this anti-religious tone that modern society seems to love and mock people of faith.
However, I don 't want them to sugar coat it either. The Inquisition and whatnot, corruption should be there but it shouldn’t be like every priest or cardinal is some scheming douchebag. You should come across all types of people. People who don’t believe but pretend they do, people who use the Bible or the Church to further their own ends, AND people who actively practice the teachings of Christianity and are good people who help others.
That would be unbiased and it would be accurate.
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I’m concerned about how they’ll show Hussites.
In Czech Republic most people buy into communist propaganda that idelised Hus and his movement.
Fact is that things were not so black and white. For example Hus made Vaclav IV pass Kutná Hora decree which basicly ruined Charles University and caused mass exodus of foreign students and professors.
This caused extreme stagnation in following century and together with Hussite movement prevented renessaince from coming to bohemia.
Hussites themselves burned hundreds of churces, monasteries and villages mostly with people inside. This ruined the country for centuries to come. Hussites also turned on each other and pesecuted various sects that emerged during the war. And I’m not even going to say what they did to Vaclav IVs corpse.
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But at the same time they complained about many of the same things Luther complained about.
And they (rightfully) didn’t think it fair that the church should own so much land.
And it also had elements of a czech proto nationalism against the “Germans”
My point is, you can easily go the other way and only show the Hussite as only evil heretics.
As FrontlinerDelta wrote, lets hope for a balanced version that both show all the good things about the church, but also the darker side.
But the fist act is in 1403… a bit early for the Hussite
It’s interesting to read all the history some of the other posters are sharing. As a Lutheran I obviously don’t want to see the church demonized; I think plenty of people have already shared that sentiment in this thread. I’d just like to see things portrayed as they were. The church was a keystone of society and influenced almost everyone to some degree. That influence wasn’t for the bad either although wrongs were committed by some men. Just write the game to present things as they were without judging and I’ll be happy.
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Yes, especially the serious taxes on peasants beside the one imposed by landlord, the political intrigues, keeping people in the dark and preaching them they should just take the suffering and starving as their due, while the clergy and the nobles were gorging themselves on food and drinks. Torture, executions of heretics, crusades. It is very offensive from anyone to just say “meh, yeah, everyone did that, but still the Church and religion is holy and kind and peaceful…” Its VERY offensive, like if someone said the holocaust did not happen. And I’m very glad that they do not have the power anymore to physically harm someone just because that person thinks differently, I’m glad it does not have the legal power to force itself on people. I bet religious people would like to bring that back…
Hello, friend, you seem frustrated?
Excellent! The rainbow flag will become the standard to which all of the pink knights rally and a new age will dawn ushered in by men with hairless chests and women with hairy legs!
They have this big octopuses in river Vltava??? Omg I’m cancelling my beer trip to Prague this minute! XD /just kidding