Surprised how CPU heavy this game is


#1

Just want to share my recent experience with the performance. I’ve been playing Kingdom Come for some time, and recently I have upgraded my computer’s CPU (from i5-6600, 32GB RAM, GeForce GTX 1070, SSD, I’ve just changed the CPU to I7-7700K (without any overclocking)). All details on Ultra setting, plus volumetric fog activated, I have quite stable 50 FPS in Rattay while with i5-6600 I had about 25 FPS there! I’ve read that the game is CPU heavy. But I am really surprised how much the i5 bottlenecked the GeForce 1070.

EDIT: So I was wrong… the game resetted the settings somehow from Ultra to High (maybe as it recognized new hardware)… so the FPS boost is not that dramatic when setting back to Ultra. 35 FPS in Rattay, still good, but I was mistaken in my original post.


#2

my gtx 1080 never hits 100% in the game


#3

It is very taxing on a whole range of system components (not designed to be played by the most people eg MMO);
CPU benefits from being six core with hyper threading or eight core.
Four core with hyperthreading is no longer overkill


#4

That’s true and I am dissatisfied with Intel as for 8th generation CPU I would need a new motherboard (have b150 chipset). I bought this i7-7700k as it was bargain (approx the same price as the i5-6600 costed me two years ago and for some reason cheaper than i7-7700), but would prefer something with more cores. However at least the game is perfectly playable on High settings now, which was sometimes issue with 4 cores without HT.


#5

you are a pc gamer and this is all part of it
i can play this on an xbox just fine with no issues, i’d rather that than the whole hassle of upgrading my shit every two months


#6

Bahahah upgrading your shit every two months.

Fact your Xbox parts inside are outdated by years before it is even released

Nobody upgrades APC every two months.

Just clearing that crazy exaggeration up. Only people who know nothing at a about a pc would say this.


#7

Well I upgrade my shit like once a couple years and have almost no performance issues (KCD is rare exception, which is generally well known for being HW demanding… but also on consoles, isn’t it?) and I am pretty satisfied being a PC gamer - I play games on PC for 20+ years and I am just used to keyboard/mouse controls. Honestly I am thinking about buying a Playstation soon but not for better gaming experience but because of the exclusive games as The Last of Us, Detroit etc.


#8

Generally the platform (mainboard/cpu/ram) is passed ontoba friend/family member or put in another room/used for multiplayer about every four years; and not much point in upgrading bideo cards sooner than ever two and a half years.

Most pc gamers spend a LITTLE BIT more than a regular cheap (unreliable) PC, with a bit of thought as to what might improve gaming (eg a ‘gaming’ monitor/keyboard/mouse)(once off purchases every five plus years)(maybe not the mouse depending on useage :wink: )

True PC gaming is a slight cost bump over cheap PCs or the flexibility of a laptop (gaming laptops can get expensive- so budget gaming is usually a box with upgradable bits…)

Gaming PCs can cost the moon… if you want all the pretty coloured lights and ‘bragging rights’.

Given an xbox x can be chewed up and spat out by my PC; and my PC cost less (sans sound card) and does more… I think consoles are too expensive:
I have to pay an annual cost for multiplayer online; more money for peripherals (that dont jump to the next platform), and more expensive games.

If a person buys more than seven games a year (new/release prices) PCs are cheap.

To get equivalent seven year aged console parts you could buy a wicked PC second hand and add a half decent graphics card.

Sure if lightning strikes you may have to swap a power supply.
Might wish to add an extra drive for media or a fast SSD for no waiting load times… its all user preference.

Doesnt have to be expensive.
Doesnt have to be constantly changing.

I did swap the drives in PS3 and PS4; beyond that- cant help them much…

If I dont change ANYTHING in my old PC it will still outmuscle the consoles for many years. (Microsoft will try to kill PC platform for gaming to force a console experience (makes them money, so who knows what the future holds !?!

Lets not perpetuate some silly myth that PCs are expensive gaming platforms - consoles stopped pushing cutting edge with the ps3.
Since then PCs have had overkill power.

In fact KCD is one of the few games to want more CPU than what PCs had a decade+ ago.
Consoles set the bar pretty low for CPU and ‘raw power’.
I had a laptop seven years ago that was very PS4 ish in grunt.
It was a budget laptop by my standards (cheapest price point for reliable hardware)

Paying a lil more for PC parts fenerally nets more reliable parts.
The gaming is just a bonus :wink:


#9

Not true. The game is not optimized properly.

Proper optimization is a long process, and they simply didn’t invest enough time into this. Actually entire game wasn’t finished on the release, and still is not.


#10

Not true?
Not sure what you are stating in my comment is incorrect- the only statement I could consider falicy there is the part about four core no longer being enough…
I will concede many future games are yet to come out that will run on four cores fine.
(Ancient I am going to guess you have a four core? I had a i7 3770k that ran north of 5ghz and ‘downgraded’ (for games) to a 5920k.
Mosy games prefer a higher primary core that the difficulties to use more cores well. (Which requires development from the ground up to achieve; which is in this fames favour).
Many people do not want to concede that consoles being massively multithreaded is the direction future games will have to go in in order for consoles to continue to deliver incredible performance.
KCD is one of the few games that are massively multicore ready/expecting.

I wholeheartedly agree that they havent yet spent enough time with this product (the studio), and that further polish is due (we are expecting the first wave of that polish with next patch; so far it has been just a few tweaks to implement better performance on a range of systems).
So yes- I will also agree the game wasnt finished on release (I too have been enjoying and will continue to receive reimplementated features and improvements).

Not sure your background in games design/programming/ and cryengine- I do notice too many people dismiss easily that they think third person games with loading zones (eg the witcher 3) have better graphics etc.
With loading zones and more distance from textures it is easy to make games LOOK better (a facade)… since gaming from the seventies I really want to put it out there how much I have never seen a game get realtime physics and massive open world game environment so right.

For all this talk about not being optimised; posters are usually working from some belief that this isnt high framerate like simpler polygonal titles like Skyrim… the raw nature (very hard to do well) in this game and the complexity of ALL models and sheer size of the world confirms this game is justified to hit as hard as it does.

Fortunately tge new AMD bargain multicore CPUs have made platforms like the x99 I use a bargain second hand find. It cost me nothing to downgrade one of the fastest i7s to the three+ year old platform I now have.

I feel pretty future ready for the next wave of titles.
KCD is the first of many.
Syppose we can afree to disagree and look back on this in a year and see how many games are yielding better results on more cores/less speed (like my 5920k) vs high speed four cores.

Well thought out games that find great use for each thread/core (like Kingdom Come: Deliverance) are rare presently…
When Crysis first came put I knew it was just a matter of time until someone used the phenominal engine to render a medieval game (knew it would be a day one purchase for me as well); took ten years- and here we are. …
Sure crysis 2 in order to get onto consoles had to render buildings (far less edges than nature), and they were very basic by comparison.
Games that render nature well are usually tight instanced areas. (Uncharted 4 is an exception; but that is a first party studio with advanced access to the hardware, and a lot of work by some of the worlds best)
Kingdom Come will continue to improve.
There are a few models that have slipped into release that bomb performance (eg first shop in Skalitz) and they will be found and fixed in time.
I really enjoy having my system pushed so hard-noticably harder than the witcher 3. Battlefield 1 multiplayer is a jeavy hitter akin to KCD and other open world titles, like Forza 3 horizon, but in general open world fames without load zones are rare due to difficulty in making them.

Dungeon Siege was a technical marvel on launch due to the nature of being able to have ‘no load zones’.

We cannot just compare KCD to other titles and say it is poorly optimised. Other titles dont capture the wind through the trees and fields… nor render large scale natural environments… in an open world setting, with no load zones.
Apples to Oranges.


#11

But you guys are moaning about the game not performing well.

I’m in a xbox and I don’t have this issue.


#12

Kirk the game has performance issues. Don’t tell me you are not galloping into a big town and people are not loaded up or a bridge is missing.

This isn’t me shitting on the game. I like the game. It is recorded fact. Consoles and pc.

The Devs have made no secret they would have liked more time. Being their first game outside pressures most definitely had forced them to release the game as best they could.being Thier first game and only starting the studio. I can forgive that for the risks they took to try get their vision out into the world. I’m hoping now with some breathing room they can release their next iterations much more polished and to the standard they themselves desire for their good work.


#13

When I first got the game and played for and hour or so with hardware stats running I was a little upset. I wasn’t hitting the fps I thought I should and my gtx1080 was only hitting 60% utilization. The game definitely needs some optimization, maybe push more processing off to the gpu or atleast reduce the settings in the presets that hit the cpu hard.

Other than the optimization and the occasional bug this game is great, fantastic graphics and awesome story.


#14

I work with Cryengine.

The first sign of bad optimization is shitty fps in interiors. And this game has big problems with performance in houses, castles, etc.
Simply KCD is rendering some things when it should not. It’s like culling does not work, or they don’t use it properly?

No, Witcher 3 doesn’t have better graphics or more advanced. But they did much better job with optimization in that game.


#15

You could steal from peoples houses in Witcher 3 and they didn’t give a shit. Thats far worse than a dip in fps so…


#16

it seems here optimisation is a term broader than Iwould wish; suspension of disbelief - is how most games render indoor environments. windows generally don’t look outside (our out at limited area of lesser complexity). Mostly games just opaque the window and, at most, carry on the sounds that the outdoor environment had (now under a muffling filter).
With Skyrim, I wouldn’t play the game without a tonne more soundbank mods (eg sounds of skyrim).
Iliked walking into dungeons and still having the storm carry on outside… or hearing people sleep in their beds at night (loud sleepers).

Where KCDgoes to overkill in buildings is in, as Ancient mentioned, the lack of culling. NOTculling outside triangles from the draw load. Sure- we don’t see them- but our CPU/GPU is still entertaining them…

The real framerate kill was the lighting (Ultra), and to be fair (playing on colour accurate, and calibrated, screens)- this is the best lighting Ihave ever seen a game use (light scattering like this used to be the realm of benchmark suits around the time of the ge force fx5X00 series… (early noughties)).

I think we need users with less than six cores plus hyper threading to back off on a few settings or else the CPUWILLbecome the bottleneck and their GPUs wont hit 100%.

Ihave always found ways to use 100% of my GPU.
If Ihad a 1080GTX @ 60% usage I would find the bottleneck and remove it.
And yes, between the game settings and the video cards drivers control panel this would be very doable.

Presently the game does have a few buildings with what Ibelieve to be ‘double sided triangles’ making up their innards…
(eg first store in Skalitz is an obvious one…)
What generally happens when asset creation get given creation tools is a learning curve.
Im my experience - teams should throw away any assets made in the first two three days as they often have issues (like not using the tools correctly and leaving triangles double sided as an easy example).

In the whole of Skalitz the only framerate bomb Iget is the store. When the game first launched I could expect 30fps with everything set to Ultra… somewhere around patch 1.2-1.3.x the game changed a few things; but NEVER has that store in Skalitz been touched upon (which Ifind incredulous as THATshould never have launched).

There are a few points around the game like that first store in Skalitz… they drop even the best rigs to half framerates…(and only around these spots).
It is pretty obvious where the issue is, and if a supervisor on the team had the time to check; these things would be fixed in a few hours.
All the trouble spots across the map (if they have been identified) could be fixed in a day.

Until that last patch that wasn’t their goal… they were literally tying to make people games work/work reliably.
worrying about a few HAVES not getting Ultra 60fps is a much later care when your games main quest is unreliable to complete.

What I see when I look at the project; the last month or so would have been a rush job direction change- pull out anything that doesn’t work well.
Unfortunately pulling stuff out (small or large) often leads to issues elsewhere.

Forum goers are happy stating that the game is now how they might have wanted to launch it… but if they hadn’t had to lose so much time to tweaking a product for a short goal lauch, and then lost twice as much time dealing with that… we would all be better off.

Except- people like me- who have had a near perfect experience with the game, can run Ultra+ settings on aged equipment, and love what they have… I have enjoyed from day one.
So Iam one of the few who can justify them launching when they did.
Of course my experience isnt what filled these forums on launch.
It is hard for me to speculate if broken games were the minority or majority.
Represented at a help desk level; happy patients dont register their health/happiness.
What we have seen is that these forums have gone comparitively silent since 1.4.3 patch.
It is safe to say by 1.4.3 patch, the game has become usable.

1.5 optimisations I hope to include a review of some building models etc to alleviate the silly framerate drops that even top end systems experience.

With regard to indoors not being ‘optimised’; most game interiors either use a load zone to drop the outside world rendering and load up extremely high quality assets. This is a software trick developers have always needed to use. KCD blows me away as I dont have to run mods like ‘open cities’ to make it more open world. Even with ‘open cities’ running- shops are still instanced affairs usually without portals to view outside. KCDs method is superior from a technical level by a large magnitude.

I agree that the first tavern in the witcher 3 looks pretty- but it is hardly fqir to compare it to the complex lighting model and true open world that Kingdom Come musters.

The coolest thing is that consoles can even attempt this. Oh how far we have come! More players on more platforms is more watercooler talk from happy gamers.
And KCD will still be impressive a few years from now. It does attempt to set the bar high.
With a few warm ups/attempts- it will set some records.


#17

So what of the pop ins? The fps don’t bother me (nothing near the fps drag I get in built up Sanctuary Hills in FO4)


#18

sometimes when we deal with one problem others cease to be.

a given video chip renders a predictable amount of triangles/ polygons/vertices etc.
Konami and namco and typical eastern studios, when they get a new platfrom to work with (eg a playstation) build tools to figure out the maximum numbers under load achievable.
They then build their game knowing their limitations.

If we have unexpected overdraw the game simply ‘slows down’.
If we can remove the bottlenecks the game should be able to ‘do its’ thing.

There are a bunch or art tools for taking a range of meshes and flattening them down into a new graphic.
Maybe the game needs a new lookup table with every clothing variable /combination rendered in flat version that would drop the draws by a factor of eight.
That would help people busy areas noticable.
It depends if we are running out of cpu or gpu as to what we have to tweak.

There is SOOOOmuch that this game can tweak.
Skyrim and the Witcher are projects that span well beyond the several hundred big teams that made them.
It is a whole world of modders that improve little things that aren’t worth the time.
ITs for the studio to figure out ‘what is worth the time’

Deal with the obvious and sometimes other stuff ‘heals’ with it.
(I trained in alternative health which is generally considered ‘preventative maintenance’; the consensus being “treat the cause and the symptoms will go away”. allopathic medicine often just targets the symptoms. Now Iwon’t say there is more money in medicine if you keep the patient sick… oh hang on, did Ijust say that?! I wan’t going to pick on BigPharma…)

As Ancient mentioned- there are so many variables in Cryengine to tweak.
What we need is for the team to put up some chatter about config files. So many users tweak varaibles. If users had a guide to knowing which variables were RAMdependant vs CPUdependant vs a combo of several, and maybe drive speeds,… we could customise this game on a per PCbasis very well.
Many wouldn’t; but at least there would be a resource of practical use with the team being involved and having an idea on which subset of users are trying to push more and for what reasons… eg many reshade mods for Skyrim were only to render nice ‘still frames’ when the game came out.
With graphics cards development over the last seven years, many of those tricky reshades are actually playable now.

Ithink some more tweaking and configing COULD (it wont) be made in this vain for all platforms.
Imagine the first time you fired KCDup it asked how many drives you wished to run the game from…
and you answer ‘2’ as you have an external thumb drive plugged into a USB.
The game can run a few benchmarks, and then suggest to you options (eg streaming cache here,… music files there…etc)
This type of clever game design did exist once and will lilely resurface.
It wasnt uncommon in the nineties to be asked which texture set or sound set a user wished to install.

The opposite is things like Forza 7 having a 120 Gigabyte download.
If users doesnt want 4k textures dont force them- it just wastes natural resources that our planet cannot afford.

Anyhow I tangented;
Like changing the pathfinding option in baldurs gate was what most playerd did (required a little bit more CPU) if they wanted their party to move half intelligently; allowing users to select multiple install locations (eg get music off main drive hammered with texture streaming/save games too), allow faster SSDs to do more; allow systems with tonnes of RAM and dedicated to gaming to do more… (imagine a RAM drive scratchpad as an example); all sorts of tweaks could be made by studio.

And as much as this post is all over the place- also have the studio moderate discussions on tweaking files for cryengine.
Their input in the discussion would be practical and no doubt experts in the public space could chime in and it would prove meaningful two way information.

I know my 1200Megabyte per second m2 and quad channel RAM could give more to this game; but instead my CPU is pushed a little harder.

This game is ‘very new’; many tweaks and improvements are yet to roll out.
Most large world games get some of their best tweaks from active user communities (like this one, ‘after the storm’).

My beef is with people who dont know what their ‘tweaked variables’ do and who blindly pass them on to all.
As an example- forza 3 horizon had one bottlenecking core (for the first eight or so months) that limited framerate capabilities.
Many found that they could improve minimum framerates hugely by forcing the first active core that didthe game away from the core 0.
Many advocated disabling core 0 (i did too; for i7 owners); the amount of time i5 owners complained that disabling a core lowered performance. (Kinda obvious to some); others just wrote the fix off as useless (it wasnt- just ‘not for them’).

When we have contributors who know what they are talking about it helps. On that front; thanks.

I like these forums.
We are at the beginning of a new game in the elite circle of large scale open world.
Should prove fun. (Watching shenanigans unfold)
In time we will all stabilse. Long term posters will come back. And the professionalism is likely to really grow.
At least until a DLC launches and the wider world takes interest again.
By that time Warhorse best be ready to show what they are made of!


#20

it’s normal because it’s an open world & these are the most greedy games, but when you watch, there are almost no loadings !! that’s not bad!


#21

Why do you mention Skyrim here? Skyrim is old-gen game with interiors as separated loading cells. It doesn’t work like KCD or W3 at all . Besides even Skyrim was unoptimized in the beginning, and actually users are responsible for fix which increased framerate in the cities by 20fps.

Graphically KCD does not impress me at all. Beta versions were impressive though. This is the biggest case of downgrade in history of video games, and despite this downgrade the game still performs bad.
The reason why this happened is because Warhorse changed their developing strategy too much. KCD was supposed to be first released for PC, and this would ensure better support for PC, better graphics and performance. This is the problem when you are deep in the development for PC, and then you decide to focus on consoles too, but with small team and lack of time.

And sorry but i don’t think it’s impressive to render some things when it should not be rendered, when player can’t see it. My experience with Cryengine is totally different then what i saw in KCD.