The Slow Combat


#21

Thats the old ass beta. Look at actual recent gameplay PLEASE. Here let me help you.


#22

Ever thought about:

  • Real life combat (whole body is involvesd, more possibilities, more sensory input) is very different from game combat (only hands to act and eyes, maybe ears, for sensroy input)
  • Nobody wants to train for 7 years, 3 times a week, to play a game for fun. a little gaming learning curve should be, so your aim isn’t alway stuck on the wrong guy.
  • if you want fast combat, go play the Arkham series or the Mordor series.

#23

Arkham Asylum is fun game.


#24

I would agree. I fight heavy rapier with the SCA, and sometimes do longsword with HEMA friends. The mechanics and armoring this game provides are adequate middle ground for what an idealist might want.

The only way to achieve true realistic sword combat in a game will be through the mastering of VR technology potential. Then, our natural weapon mechanics may potentially work at their most realistic and believable. Until then, any system in between will have the problems @Tsunamik described above with response times and delays. I like fast paced fighting - Bloodborne doing skill/bloodtinge builds, for example - but to step in the realm of realism requires a lot of move automation that takes away from that control. It’s a tenuous balance, and I hope KCD nails it the way many posters here are leading me to believe.


#25

Combat as in the playable beta feels very slow and clumsy to me as well. I know the difference between exhibition fights and real medieval sword art, and this game has not much to do with the real fight.
It feels slow, unflexible and overcomplicated and as far as that i can totally understand what you mean. The game in total has not developed in a way i thought when i backed this, especially with the combat mechanisms.


#26

You really should judge the product from final version, not from nearly two years old beta


#27

is it not impudent enough that they gave us a beta, which gets no update at all?
Why did we back for it? Why does it even exist? We cannot help with development, when we cant see the changes they make, except for some videos?


#28

Beta filled its purpose thx to feedback from backers back in time when that feedback had a chance to be addressed :slight_smile: After that, the game was just finalizing.
Sadly I can´t tell you why you backed for it, but I guess we all had our reasons :smiley:


#29

This looks much better


#30

Thats not the most recent build either c:


#31

I doubt that I ever bought or played any game that you were a part of developing and I own over 400 PC games, but maybe I have purchased one? Why don’t you tell us which games you had a part in developing,… or at least a few, like the top selling ones you had?.. Unless you are afraid of some constructive criticism of some of those games you helped developed, that is?


#32

I’m not gonna buy this game, blah blah blah
There is criticism. then there is this pile of shite.

Which funnily enough always sounds the same when you cut the bullshit . Yes “I’m not gonna buy this game” but yet I’m still registering an account on the forum of a game I have no intention getting to complain why? because even slugs have more going on than I do.

You’re just like those fools that said" not gonna buy the game" after they complained “no black people in the game”. You Fools weren’t gonna buy anything either way, just wanted to piss and moan. Desperate for someone to give a shit. then after alls said and done. move off to the next thing to endlessly piss and moan about.

Comes up in here crapping on about the combat being shit then has the complete audacity to mention skyrims combat? This some kinda joke. I actually hope you’re a troll because if not you’re just another complete fuckwit.


#33

@Robert, I have graduated from the Media Deisgn School with a Graduate Diploma Level 7 (Degree) of Game Development, I then went on to make a game called Shards Of Destiny which is based on the Quake 3 engine. I worked on some small (unreleased to the public) projects including making a 3D 1st person recreation of the technology department for Massey University (they wanted a live 3d representation of the communication data flowing through thier servers, boring stuff), And I’ve modded alot of games including making a mod called Moar Kontent for Skyrim in 2012. After that, I couldnt find any work here that involved my skills in game development so I became a stock manager/retail service assistant in a computer tech shop for the last 5 years, waiting for the next big thing to come along (VR). Honestly I’m only average at what I do but I sure do know the business.


#34

DaMuncha,… Well at least you mentioned 1 known game you were involved with, and like I said, I most likely never bought it, which I didn’t. Shards of Destiny was never on my wish list of games I wanted, nor needed. Anyway, congratulations on your Graduate Diplomas, but that does NOT mean that only your way is the right way to do things. Everyone has their opinions and preferences on what they like and what they would like to see in a game. What you like, I might hate and vice-versa. There is no such thing as a perfect game,… at least I’ve yet to see one in all my years of gaming. I guess that’s why Modding communities became so popular, so that people could add MODS they like in their gaming experience and ignore the MODS that they don’t like. As gamers, we all have choices to purchase and play the games we want, or not to do so. Pretty simple IMHO… Happy gaming and have a great life!


#35

There’s so much wrong within these posts, I honestly don’t know where to start. Let’s just pick out one or two small points: The fact that you consider 7 years of aikido a great achievement while spilling stuff that literally makes no sense in the European martial arts (Yes, we’re in Europe, not in Asia!) tells me more about your bad understanding of what the art of Aikido is all about than about what’s wrong with KCD.

Aikido is a Martial Art, it does tell you a lot about the general psychological and physical idea behind swordfighting, but it doesn’t work the same in the “world outside the dojo”. The reason why Aikido is that hilariously fast is in fact that you don’t wear armor. Believe it or not, but wearing an European-styled platearmour SLOWS YOU DOWN. You also won’t have success with fancy “oh he raises his arm, I will instantly cut his hands”-moves – it simply won’t work in most of the cases due to two reasons: a) You are slow yourself b) Platearmor does actually do a great job when it comes to protecting yourself from cuts.

Yes, fights were over quite fast in certain moments: When you slashed your mace into your opponents head, for example. But fights between two heavily armored opponents with swords? Have fun trying to end the fight by tickling his hands, feet or anything else. Aikido is literally based on the fact that your opponent is valuable to cuts. Be surprised, it obviously doesn’t work the same as soon as the opponent wears proper European armour.
You CANNOT compare Asian martial arts and European medieval martial arts. The fact that you’re still trying to do so tells a lot about you.

I agree with you that KCD has some kinda silly “dancing”-moments - but how should one fix that? You simply can’t.
The idea of having a “realistic” physical fight while sitting in front of a screen pressing buttons is so hilariously wrong in itself. You can try to make it as realistic as possible, but it will just be a depiction of a fight, no physical fight. The footwork, the mental problems and the pure physical brutality that define hand-to-hand-combat really can’t be represented while you’re sitting comfortably in front of your screen. That’s a fact.
You also CANNOT represent physical combat in a game by pressing buttons. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE. You trying to take the piss out of the gamemechanics being unrealistic, but at the same time coming up with “huh let’s just make fancy buttoncombinations to fix it” tells a lot about your understanding of fighting. It’s just non-existing, plain and simple.
You really shouldn’t use the word” kiddies” while trying to bring up 7 lousy years of Aikido to tell everyone else how medieval combat, or fighting in general, worked and still works. It just won’t work for yourself, take that as a lesson for life.


#36

Armour doesn’t slow you down to a crawl.

And medieval fencing is as complex and fast as other traditional sword based martial arts.
However, when you are practising real HEMA, it takes a looong time to build up muscle memory and reflexes to the point of you actively being that fast and efficient, being able to react to tiny movements.

However, you are directly and fully connected to your body, every joint, muscle and so forth. So in reality, you have more ways of receiving sensory input and a much shorter reaction time to start an action. You do not have to perform two handed spasms to press 18 diffrent buttons in the correct order, to perform a certain hau. you just do it.

And you do not have the sensory input of the opponents blade or body blocking your weapons path.

So every game has to be diffrent, more limited and slower, so as not to be super frustrating.

In the end, I wouldn’t make a fuzz about every little detail. No game i have ever played in my life was "perfect2, there were always things I personally would have liked to be a bit diffrent.

But you know what: I am content with ‘good’ games.


#37

Besides, as far as I understand, this Game is not going to be a 95% sword fighting game. It has story and you can interact with people etc. …combat is only a small part of the overall experience.

As per combat being to restrictive and unrealistic, well…I’m a huge fan of of the 17th and 18th C. and I have yet so see any game with decent options to start the multi step process of reloading a matchlock musket, stop half-way, beat an approaching enemies teth out with the musket, to continue loading afterwards…


#38

I imagine a perfect game with totally realistic combat. Probably done with some sort of futuristic VR. It has all the necessary features - you really feel the sword in your hands, it really moves as fast as your muscles go, you have no limitations on what to do with it. When sword clashes against opponent’s one, you can feel the pressure, control it work with it. It is totally realistic.

Two observations about this realistic combat system:

  1. We already have it, and it is called “reality”. Buy a sword (it is a bit more expensive than normal game, but hey, it’s PERFECT!), find an opponent, and play as you like. I guarantee that physics will work in exactly the same way as it worked in middle-ages.

  2. You will need a lot of training before you would be able to finght in such game. Exactly the same amount as you need to to fight with sword in real life.


#39

@Ted good points, and @Tsunamik made some good points

@Kaven , I realised a few months ago after watching Hodi’s demo of the towns that “Wow this game looks beautfiful, so realistic” I looked out the window and where I live in NZ looks exactly like the Bohemia landscape in the game. I was telling my dad (65 and plays FPS games) “The forests are incredible, they look exactly like the park nearby, You would love it” Then it dawned on me, why dont I just go for a walk outside? because I’m lazy and I cant run around cutting peoples heads off in real life, :stuck_out_tongue:

Aside from the haters I have found this a good discussion and I have now changed my mind about the combat. And I hope to play this when it comes out. But even then, I still hope that they will make the actual combat input more streamlined. I have another game called War Of The Roses which I liked for a short while, but to attack from different angles you need to hold the attack button, move your mouse over to that direction and let go, but doing that meant that your view would wildly veer off, and then it would play the slow attack animation. It made the combat very clunky and difficult to use smoothly, and the blocking used the same mechanic, so made it very difficult to defend your self. My only fears were that Kingdom Come is going to use this same mechanic.


#40

Well KCD uses something similar, but more thought through imo.

You can preselect your angle of attack, then you click the button to attack from that side.
Because there is lock on, your view stays focused, so this issue is settled.
You can also make feint - you select your attack, you hold button to start the attack and before you release it, you change your direction - this way you can feint your enemy and bypass his block.

And yeah, the forests are incredible :slight_smile: I definitely advise everyone to play this game on very high settings if you can afford it.