Video - To those who are saying "Combat is impossible" after patch - 1.3 combat Test

Just downloaded 1.3 and 1.3.1, tested combat, and am glad to say that it’s not changed that much. I feared they changed too much of a game which I enjoyed immensely, and thank God I can still enjoy it. Here’s the two-shot:

I also tested on Bandit leaders and guards, can post it if you like.

The only real problem is lockpicking simplification.

Unfortunately there are still people in 2018 who can’t play video games very well. They should just leave them alone IMO, or at least not request changes to the displeasure of those people who have 30 years of video gaming experience, perhaps spending too many hours in video games (already 80 hours in this game alone).

Short story, the game was fine, it is still fine.

4 Likes

the changes are good, no more godmode after mid game. it seems they beefed up that plate armor, which is a good thing

Let me ask you, what is the problem with being a God in an RPG based on traditional levelling mechanics?

I want to be a God. I don’t want scaled levelling, I don’t want bandits with Nurembergian plate armor.

I want to be a God simply because I have worked hard towards achieving that God-like status. Otherwise, what is the point of levelling?

It’s like if in real life you would study at university, honing your chosen craft for years, only to find that everyone else has caught up to you, including those who have not done particularly brilliantly in academic terms, in order to make the world “balanced.”

1 Like

KDC’s fundamental design flaw with combat is not the system itself, it’s the fact that you’re almost always expected to fight more than one opponent, which completely negates a lot of the tactics because you’re getting hit from behind/side while you engage an opponent.

I give credit for WH creating this system, but they really need to re-think this whole 1 vs 2-7 enemies nonsense. This fact is the most historically inaccurate part of the game! In addition, two opponents engage you while the others stand there watching.

The changes they implemented in 1.3 actually made the early-game significantly harder than the late game. Good luck even hitting an enemy before you can do advanced training with Bernard! Which unfortunately is after a series of quests that force you into fights with multiple enemies in order to complete it.

1 Like

@PvtBooger
Do you mind saying where your skills and stats are? Looks like those guys were fighting back fairly well, considering. I think I was ~lvl 16 when I did that quest and they were complete pushovers.

I disagree about multiple opponents, as the combat principles are the same, the system remains unchanged. It is also unwise to take on multiple opponents before level 10. Once you acquire parry-and-riposte (the green shield), and master strike, the combat is easy.

The combat is based around a realistic feel, just being patient and using more than just your sword. Use your grapples, your kicks (F) and keep moving around opponents. Run. Hide behind a bush. Even sheathe your sword and use punches. All things that are perfectly valid and will win you fights.

I don’t like to keep on repeating the old “Git Gud” adage, and being a Dark Souls player it would be a rather easy thing to do, but some players stand still, learn a few combos and expect to be able to beat a level 15 bandit leader at low level. That’s not how it works here, and I certainly hope it won’t be changed in future patches. They have already ruined lockpicking and pickpocketing because a few completely inept players (yes, I should get off the pedestal, but can you blame me? I had fun before…) cried outrage with their pitchforks and torches.

Moreover, and lastly (to your relief, I might add), the game does not “Force You” to do anything. You don’t have to train with Bernard. There are multiple ways of exploiting the levelling system, without cheating. Just simply grind somewhere else before doing something. It seems people don’t have patience anymore, and want to turn this into another tedious Bethesda pulp, where the game becomes a snore-fest after its first 20 hours of play.

2 Likes

I am level 20 and have put 130+ hours into game - I know how it works very well and my statement about the combat system still stands :slight_smile:

the problem is that your sword isn’t made of god particles and should therefore still have the requisite numbers of hacks and stabs before it can rbeak down plate, chain, and/or thick fabric armor. you can be as skilled as you want, you still can’t defy physics.

How can you say the combat principles are the same when in the next sentence you suggest putting away your sword and going to hand-to-hand combat, which seems extremely realistic …

The multiple enemies system is flawed :frowning:

1 Like

I started a new game, it’s no longer trivial. Early game you have to pick your fights and reduce the number of enemies. Once you get past the coal burners mission, just side quest until you’re decked out. If the combat is too hard, sidequest/train and try again later. Just use the ruin quests as a measuring stick. If you can’t finish part 2 of ruin, you’re probably too weak/unskilled to clear the first boss.

The game needs more solo-based encounters. You train and train and train with Cpt Bernard in a 1 vs 1 arena, but out in the world you’re almost always facing between 3 - 7 enemies at a time regularly. It is possible to create a challenging and fun combat system without there being multiple enemies in every encounter.

1 Like

I agree. It would be nice to take one on ones more often. I hope that will be possible in the future. Anyway i think several enemies at once is just annoying but not problem. Yesterday i beated second camp from Sasau. It wasnt easy but i had to do some serious planning and real intensive fights.

That’s right! It’s extremely historically inaccurate, in a real fight you would NEVER get attacked by more than one person at a time! Real swordfights weren’t about life and death at all, they were just casually fooling around with swords and their knightly honour (this was true especially for bandits) prevented them from helping out their friends if they got into such a fight. Even thieves and bandits preferred to die in a fair fight if the other option was to stay alive by outnumbering the enemy! It’s still the same today in firearms fights, if you watch some videos from Afghanistan or Syria on Liveleak, you’ll see that even the terrorists stay mindful of this principle, you can see for example the taliban snipers going “oh, you’re shooting at that one too? Fuck! That’s unfair!”.

The combat system is fairly acceptable but the greatest problem is the context of the game always puts you into 1 vs multiple opponents, sometimes without good reasons. Like, what the hell does Bernard think about sending young newbie solo against a bandit camp?

About “god tier” problem, I think it’s just a simplified way to demonstrate that our Henry has become so good at combat that his simple stab always goes to the armor’s gap and lethally injures his enemies. Well, they may try to implement some kill-animation to justify it, but…

1 Like

You should be able to do the advanced training right after finishing the basic training with Bernard. I’ve got there without killing anyone, or engage to multi opponent combat.

But if you do not know about it and trigger the next main quest, Bernard will not be at arena until much later.

I didn’t know you could train with Bernard from the start. So you can go there right after waking up in Peshek’s house?

I just took on three guys in plate armor and won. The fight lasted thirty real-life minutes, but it was nonetheless very enjoyable and challenging, and this is precisely what I was looking for. No more of this “god mode” nonsense, PLEASE! I still stand by my position pre-patch: the game was insultingly easy and every time I one-hit killed an opponent wearing armor I cringed hard and wanted to quit right then and there. Now I’m actually enjoying it a little more, but still feel it is quite easy. Before the patch, I absolutely hated seeing my character overpower literally everybody he fought. It made combat very trivial and more of an annoyance rather than a life-death situation as it is supposed to be! In fact, I even purposefully avoided unlocking any perks relating to strength just because combat was too easy! I’ll forgive unarmored bandits being easy kills, because even in real life any bladed-weapon will kill someone who is unprotected relatively quickly, but here I’ll need to define unarmored. I only consider an opponent to be unarmored when he is wearing absolutely nothing besides his basic clothing such as a tunic, a set of hoses, and a pair of shoes. Nothing beyond that. Even a padded gambeson provided significantly greater protection against slash and blunt damgage over regular clothing, and I want and expect that to be reflected in game. A cut (with a cutting weapon such as a sword) against an opponent wearing a gambeson should not instant kill or significantly damage an opponent in one-hit. Try using a knife and cutting layered linen in real life and see how hard it actually is. Also, please stop using this “Henry is just aiming for the gaps in armor” excuse, because even inside those weak-points in plate armor your opponent should be wearing a set of chainmail armor and then a gambeson underneath. Try stabbing through riveted chainmail and see how easy it is to actually penetrate though…yeah.

I can provide a suggestion on how to possibly address this: Gambesons wear out in real life the more you beat on them. If your opponent is wearing just a gambeson for protection, then we could possibly see Henry’s initial attacks doing low damage against him until he is able to wear down the condition of the enemy AI’s armor below 30%. Afterwards I’ll accept his attacks being more effective.

TLDR; more challenging combat = more fun. If balancing to compensate for less-skilled or low-leveled players is needed, then simply provide less-skilled and poorly-equipped (no armor) opponents earlier on in the game, and then slowly add more difficult opponents as the player progresses through the main questline (notice I didn’t say with his level, although even that should be taken into consideration). I want and expect a fight against a well-armored opponent to be a lengthy and challenging ordeal, which is how it is SUPPOSED to be!

So yes, I actually am going to use the “get good” line here, because I feel as though nearly all of the people complaining about combat being “impossible” are trying to approach the game with a casual playstyle and inevitably want it dumbed down. If I can take on three plate-armor knights who are skilled enough to successfully parry every like 3rd attack I threw at them, and still win, then it is very clear combat is not “impossible.” Far from actually. As I said, I still think it’s quite easy, although thankfully not as easy as before.

But, if all else fails…then a difficulty option could be considered, with the lower settings being more “gamey” and the higher ones more realistic and hard.

What’s the point in leveling up? Using better armor, weapons, and combat combos are three I can think of off the top of my head while avoiding turning the game into a boring roflstomp against AI…

You misinterpreted. It’s historically inaccurate that one person would be asked to roam the world and take on camps of bandits and Cumans in groups of 3 - 7 vs 1. Don’t even start with the “you don’t have to do it” nonsense … the game is structured around sending the protagonist into these scenarios so at the very least, a 24/7 AI companion would make a lot of sense.

1 Like