Will there be ...children?

In real life children are usually kept under the watchful eye of adults. You won’t find a child alone in the middle of the wilderness. Children are quick and nimble. With careful scripting and positioning with nearby hiding places, npc children could be placed in locations surrounded by npc adults. If /when a player arms them selves with a weapon the npc children could be programmed to instantly run away and hide, any adults in the area would then immediately turn upon and attack the player verbally and or with violence, thereby making it impossible for the player to attack any children. This would resolve the issue, and keep it real.

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That’s a nice idea; but that would be only possible if the NPC could ALWAYS beat you, even if you are full-armored knight and they are some poor villagers, what is not very realistic.
In my opinion, this could be fixed if the ones attacking when the character tries to kill children were guards.

No, the npcs do not need to kill you, just distract you long enough for the children to run away. As soon as the kids are out iv your sight they can be removed from the game until you disarm yourself.

Don’t forget that this would be under the control of the programmers, they could make it so that it takes a few seconds for your character to arm himself, when near children, giving them time to leg it. If the player arrives in the area pre-armed, then the children would already be hiding. This is supposed to be a violent time so children wouldbescared of armed strangers.

That idea could easily screw you over if a child happens to be near you when you need to arm yourself. It also doesn’t cover bows. Unless you try to attack a child, how would it make sense for anyone to “distract” you? Just pulling out a weapon and everyone assuming you’re going to attack a kid sounds really annoying.

There isn’t any way you could reasonably stop players from attacking children, if only by bow and arrow. The rest of this needlessly complicates things while introducing potential issues and making the game feel more restrictive, just make them immortal and be done with it.

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4 posts were split to a new topic: Politics Fakefakts?

Point taken, however this could be carefully scripted by the programmers so that the children are in safe areas, and you would not be attacked when near them, so you would not have a need to arm yourself.
For example the children could be indoors. You try to arm your self with a bow, and they quickly hide, so that by the time you have equiped youself theyhave dissapeared.

At that point their behavior will be unrealistic on the face of it. If they’re only immortal, you’ll be pulled out of immersion if you try to kill one, but if they act in such a strange way, you’ll notice it without having to do anything.

I see the idea is to try to make it so players don’t realize they’re immortal, but the sheer fact that the game is actively protecting them would make it just as evident.

Think about it this way. You are in a restaurant with your family and kids, and a man suddenly pulls out a gun. Are you going to admire the gun, attack the person that is waving the gun, run away, or try to protect your children? The point is that, with a little thought, and careful programming it must be possible to create an area with children, to at least give the game/world the feeling, that it is not just populated by adults.

Yes there is, just place them in natural positions - Wherever they’d actually be, and make them immortal. They’d be immortal in your plan as well, but what you’ve said requires additional unnatural behavior and restrictions.

Of course they weren’t added at all, and so discussion about how best to do it seems pointless.

In some other games, I would agree with you. However I understand that the story/plot in this game is that some people havebeen attacked and killed, and war is brewing. So in this scenario I would imagine that people would be fearful, they would be keeping their children close to hand, and away from dangerous places. The idea is to make this feel real, and the game story can explain the behavior of the children and parents.

How is indoors safe? Let’s say you lock yourself up alone in a room with a kid. So where does it hide? Where does it run? Door is blocked/locked, windows closed/too small. Indoors is a perfect trap for a childkiller :slight_smile:

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You are forgetting that this in the control of the programmers, they would not place the children in that environment in the first place.

Got it! The game would never let me near the children. I could only observe them from a distance “stalker style”. Yet if i tried to kill them from a distance with a bow, the would hide. Hide where? Every village has a vault 13 for distressed children in case I equip a weapon in my inventory? Into the woods and meadows? What about their daily cycles. They would be pretty screwed up being interrupted five times a day with running and hiding.
If a tried to kill them from a close range, instead of swiftly drawing my sword like a level 100 warrior, I would all of a sudden fumble up in my inventory like a retard to give the kids a headstart while their parents would form a human chain tryin to “distract” me. Good luck to developers with creating a safe environment…
I’m begining to see why the developers left the kids out :smiley:

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Hmm, I think that the point is that players should NOT be trying to kill the children.

I understand that Warhorse are trying to recreate a realistic medieval sandbox world. It seems to me that the world would not be complete without children. However I find the idea that players could kill children morally repugnant, hence my suggestions. I envisioned scenarios where a player either accidentally kills a child in the game, or has a moment of curiosity - (ie, I wonder what would happen if I fired my arrow at that kid), my ideas are, as far as possible, to keep the immersion in the game for the player, although I accept that compromises may have to be made.

HOWEVER if someone wants to use the software to use a computer game to act out their fantasy of killing children, then this is completely different. (I am sure that no one reading this post would ever dream of doing such a thing.) Then I do not care that they keep their immersion, and in my view - if the game detects that a player is actually hunting children then it should immediately throw the player out of the game and display a warning message, and in the case of repeated attempts delete all of the players saved games as well!

If someone had that fantasy, acting it out in a game would be a good thing. If that’s enough for them, GOOD. Do I have to spell out the alternative to you?

This is utterly ridiculous. So many things wrong with it. First off, it’s hypocritical to hold pretending to kill kids so high over pretending to kill adults, both are awful in real life yet only one is awful in video games? Secondly, even if someone did this, it affects nothing in real life whatsoever. That includes you. An option existing in a false reality does not affect you or anyone else at all.

You’re acting as if there are some sort of real life consequences for this. There aren’t. The thought upsets you, so you feel your “righteous moral outrage” should be enforced upon on others. That isn’t right.

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Sadly there have been real life cases where people have done just that, which is why I believe it it is illegal to create games that allow children to be killed.

I am not generalising, I know that the vast majority of people will not do this, however there are some sick individuals that do.

The game is a violent game, I understand that, and have no issue with it, I play games like this all the time. But the line must be drawn at killing children!

All I am saying is that to have a realistic game it should include children, and that there should be mechanisms to prevent them from being killed. In Skyrim the children are simply immortal, and do not take any damage at all - which is not realistic. The conversation in this post is about making the children unkillable without breaking the immersion of the game, and keeping it as realistic as possible.

I feel that compromises have to be made, however some commentators seem to get very upset if their character would be unable to kill children in the game. Which is why I made my previous post.

It is wrong to fantasise or worse, act out - killing children, even in a game! and ANY parent will tell you the same.

Do you understand what I meant here^? If someone has that fantasy it is is better to act it out in a game than in real life. Do you think someone that already has that fantasy is more or less likely to actually do it in real life if they have no “outlet” at all?

Done what, you didn’t quote anything. Killed children? No shit. Whatever you meant, no that isn’t why games that allow that are so often barred from countries, it’s because of people like you that believe their emotions should dictate what can and can’t be depicted in games.

Based on what. Your argument is “Because I PERSONALLY hate it, my opinion should be enforced on everyone”. Why is mass murder of adults so much more palatable to you than one child dying, why is this the arbitrary line at which fictional violence is suddenly connected to real life?

We understand it can’t be done thanks to a lot of countries not allowing it, we get upset that some people think their emotions and opinions should dictate what can and can’t be added, that them feeling bad about something is a good enough reason to cut a single thing.

Guess what, it’s wrong to kill ANYONE, and yet for some reason people are rational enough to grasp that killing adults in video games means nothing despite that, while there is some sort of mental block that stops them from thinking clearly when it’s children instead.

Try to rationalize the fictional murder of children as something entirely different from the fictional murder of adults, why it doesn’t matter at all unless they’re a certain age. So far all you’ve done is proclaim this as fact.

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Killing innocents is wrong. However this game is a war game, and that involves battles, with the opponents fighting back. Having a sword fight with an enemy is completely different to shooting an innocent child with an arrow for target practice. I don’t understand how someone could look at a a child playing in the street and think that the little girl is a valid target

Do you understand what I meant here^? If someone has that fantasy it is is better to act it out in a game than in real life. Do you think someone that already has that fantasy is more or less likely to actually do it in real life if they have no “outlet” at all?

I think that happens to start with, but sadly I also think that this does not cure their itch, I fear that it only feeds it, and makes it worse; which is why I am concerned enough to continue contributing to this post.

I can see that a lot of people are passionate about this topic. I am trying to find a way for Warhorse to include children in their game. So I started writing my posts within this topic to suggest ways that this could be achieved. I have given my suggestions and yes, they have compromises. However it seems that a lot of people are not willing to compromise, and wish to have killable children in the game. I don’t think that will happen (Otherwise they would already be in the game).

So instead of finding fault in every word I write, how about either;

Suggesting some good reasons for allowing the killing of ‘in game’ children (Which seems to be the argument you are making).

Or

Suggesting other ways to make this work so that everyone is happy; even if that means accepting some compromises.

It would be a sad day if Warhorse decide to keep children completely out of the game.